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| 万维读者网 > 高山流水 > 帖子 |
| 花腔女高音的PK | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 送交者: lisovsky 2014年12月30日20:46:46 于 [高山流水] 发送悄悄话 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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 Ethan A. 10 months ago HALLSTEIN. Despite where Gruberova was
obviously an excellent coloratura in many roles, Hallstein does not
make it sound like a challenge whatsoever - she is a truly natural lyric
coloratura soprano instead of a soprano who obtained high notes and
agility through practise. View all 3 replies primohomme 4 months ago Sure, sure, and yet Gruberova’s
Elettra completely lacks the middle and middle register absolutely
necessary, especially in the first aria, and Hallstein with a "pea
sized voice" managed to project from C4 to C6 better and with more
resonance, how is that possible? Vette gaddia 4 months ago +primohomme I
love Hallstein’s voice even if she had a pea size voice. I hate grubi’s
voice cause it is dreadful technique of scooping on even notes below a
middle G. I likewise can’t coloraturafan cause he is a fake. He claims
to love Joan, Maria and Bev. But he does videos proclaiming Grubi and
Devia as the bel canto queens. I don’t dislike u even if you attack me
at one time. So your fav is Maria and mine is Joan, that’s cool. The
only reason I doubted you is as many loves you have for Joan, there are
2x’s more insults that Joan only had one octave of great notes Eb to Eb
in alt. If that is true, she would have been booed for Esclarmonde,
since that Wagnerian orchestration of Massenet’s would be impossible for
any soprano who did not have a large middle voice with phenomenal
extention to the E flat in alt. Esclarmonde spends 2 1/2 hours on the
middle voice n low voice. Having heard her live, I can tell you her her
middle voice was very lush. For Esclarmonde, the audience gave her a 20
minute ovation after the opera. We all up our fav sopranos. I understand
this. Bottom line is I’ve heard Joan live n you have not. The studio
doesn’t begin to do her voice justice. Read more  arya pujon 6 months ago i don’t know if opening part of bell song by Ingeborg at 4:39 is contain G6 Wow.she was a High coloratura soprano...; G. B.C. 4 months ago ACCUSED OF DIGITAL...! AAHHAHA SHE TOLD ME: I DID NOT WANT TO GO TO U.S. WHEN WHERE NO SYNTHESISERS!!! schattensand 10 months ago You give the answer describing the difference, so what is the point.  TheMaleAvenger 10 months ago Hallstein destroyed her in all registers.  OperaMyWorld 11 months ago Ingeborg Hallstein sings like an angel
with perfect High notes always on pitch!!But I prefer Gruberova’s voice
even with the scoop...she has a warmer sound and better trills!!Both
are unique ofcourse but If I gave to choose one I would choose
Gruberova!!  newhere66 11 months ago Gruberova sang Queens, she s the
Queen, BUT :) <3 Hallstein beats the emotions(Gruberova too!), and is
simply-unique. My voice for Ingeborg :*  sachmetixchel 1 year ago in reply to primohomme No dije que desafinara, de hecho, nunca la he escuchado desafinar  Därrius Butler 1 year ago I’ve been introducedto Halstein
through your videos, andI just wanna say thankypier. Her voice is magic.
Not hating on the other lady in this video, but Hallstein sounds 1000x
better in every single passage you’ve showcased. Plus, that is a
beautiful picture of her. Her voice is extremely refined. Love it.  primohomme 1 year ago in reply to Daniel Ramírez de Gastón You dumb fuck, coloratura is not
"greatness, magnificente and splender in opera". Coloratura is a MEANS
OF EXPRESSION, and means to an end. The purpose of coloratura isn’t to
show the voice but to EXPRESS an emotion within the piece. You should
really consider killing yourself, your stupidity is just beyond. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak That’s interesting considering
BZBlaner doesn’t even have a facebook.
Do you really think popularity equals quality? Then Sarah Brightman is
the greatest bel canto singer to ever live, and I can assure you then
that Bartoli’s Norma will be the definitive one since her performances
are sold out months in advance and the CD’s pre-order has already
achieved gold status.  MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to primohomme I heard these before you were born. Listen again. The upward lift on ’iiiiiiiiiinargenti’ - queeEEEste primohomme 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak is that why Ingeborg and Renee Fleming would compliment Gruberova? :D  LohengrinTh 1 year ago in reply to primohomme what fellow fans? you mean
coloraturafan multiple accounts with which he logs and discusses with
himself like: Coloraturafan: isnt mariala fantastic? coloraturafan2: she
is la Divina, coloraturafan3: she is better than maria callas,
coloraturafan5: whooo? :)))) primohomme 1 year ago in reply to Cry of Soul I am not a fan of Celine but I got nothing against her. In either case, the obvious does not need to be spelled out.  edgeofevolution 1 year ago in reply to jmiller05 Sumi Jo, definitely lol.  IloveArethaFranklin 1 year ago I never understoof a lot of the
Gruberova hate.. At one time she was AMAZING... I don’t know what
happened.. or why she started getting criticized so heavily. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to coloraturafan Sweetheart, I think you must have
hallucinated...because I never called you a fag. Look through the
comments, that was simionato6.
My character? I am a bitch, everybody knows that :) I don’t pretend to
be a victim so other people come defend me. I mean, nobody was attacking
you and you felt the need to send this video to your friends so they
would throw a fit. Now, see how stereotypical that is?  BZBlaner 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak Just like how you openly admitted to
stalking a person by searching their name on Google and threatening to
publish information? Your poor son - waking up each day to a fucking
psychopath :) I’m sure that’s mentally comforting.  Slaychelle 1 year ago Why am I getting more entertainment from all these comments than the video?
X___X
A messTTT LOL  Tuxster3 1 year ago in reply to coloraturafan I’m glad you’ve been here! I’ve always
loved your YouTube channel. Just block the trouble makers and let the
rest of us continue to enjoy your videos! :D primohomme 1 year ago in reply to coloraturafan No. My comment about Gruberova’s "gay
hairdresser fans" was meant as a joke. I have a taste for satire and
dark comedy as you have a flare for hystrionics. You just took my joke
way too seriously and got offended without being actually personally
insulted (until you showed up and threw a hissy fit, that is).
I’m not saying one type of singing is better or worst, my point was
simply to defend Ingeborg against malicious attacks of obsessed fans.
Just as you have compared Devia against Fleming :) LohengrinTh 1 year ago in reply to primohomme I would add up to the conversation but
I just wrote that this person actually thinks that Grubarova sang
Roberto Devereux well (by cutting off 50% of the written notes) No ty Id
rather get into a discussion with a Christina Aguillera fan ahahahahah MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak /watch?v=2Ru6uKufN7g Plancon. sonnambula arie - broad portamenti up to, down to the note.  jmiller05 1 year ago Sumi Jo or Gruberova? :P  agators212 1 year ago Gruberova sounds more....hmmm how do i
put it in words...like there is far more effort on her part? like i can
see her almost thinking about the notes she has to sing (maybe why she
scoops on those high notes). Hallstein on the other hand just sounds so
fluid throughout. so easy throughout. i don’t know if what i just
said made sense haha BZBlaner 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak I said that when Edita attempted Norma. edgeofevolution 1 year ago in reply to Slaychelle There was no precision in those flat
notes and in those non-existent lows. Hallstein is far more accurate
pitch-wise, she has a larger range and more ease at both ends. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to IloveArethaFranklin Hallstein. Dessay has had some great
moments though, her Morgana (Handel’s Alcina) is fantastic, and her
Dinorah is also quite great. Also in Mozart high coloratura repertoire,
she is fabulous. But she has descended into trash in the last 10 years,
as her recent "Cleopatra" shows. MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to BZBlaner Calma, calma il tuo tormento primohomme 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak Me OCD? Oh no, I’m antisocial personality disorder with a dash of malignant narcissist and a hue of borderline :)  Cry of Soul 1 year ago I think it would be so nice if you’d
do a video comparing The so-called "Vocal Trinity", to show how Celine
Dion was not worth of it.  asdfopera 1 year ago i think the gruberova-hallstein
comparison began on the straniera video i uploaded. hallstein had a
pristine sound and technique whereas gruberova, arguably, sings with
more flaws. for instance, gruberova is always accused of scooping.
however, gruberova is still singing into her 60s. some of her flaws have
been heightened, but i think the roles she sings today are
unprecedented for a 66 y/o soprano. good for her and her fans
(who/whatever they are).  Voodoo Manman 1 year ago 諾爾瑪這樣的角色本來就是寫給格魯貝洛娃這樣的音色。笑死人了！貝里尼歌劇戲劇化
這樣的爛風氣完全是卡拉絲這幫人帶起來的！後面的卡巴耶還有思科託更糟糕，卡拉絲如果沒有那個團隊來吹噓她悲劇性的一生，這個明星效應如何咦髌饋恚磕銈�
腦殘歌迷說格魯貝洛娃的中聲區空？她聲帶閉合的能力又是哪個女高音可以比的？薩色蘭那種噢噢嘴才叫空！本以為你們洋鬼子歌迷素質有多靠譜，呵呵還不快跪拜
我朝威武！ agators212 1 year ago in reply to primohomme ok good...haha. i don’t listen to a
lot of opera compared to when i was in voice lessons several years back.
but i don’t know these two singers catalog but hallstein is very
beautiful. delicate but quite powerful as well.  Ctmagnus 1 year ago Hallstein is a great singer alright,
and she reminds me of Galli Curci (without the flatness) with her limpid
quality and ease of singing. Coloratura is as easy for her as falling
off a log. But I find her a bit of a canary. I think I’d rather hear
Gruberova (or Sutherland or Dessay or Sills or...) They would keep me
far more interested in what I was watching with their energized singing
and breadth of tone. Just my two cents worth (and probably only worth
one)  kathryn ryder 1 year ago I enjoyed this posting because it
clarified why I love these sopranos. Hallstein’s voice is exquisite and
natural. She never pushes it beyond. Her voice is actually soothing
to me. Gruberova sings the same fach, but she is more a creature of the
theatre and she acts through her voice. I find her glottal attacks
thrilling - even if rather vulgar! In this Gruberova is very similar to
Beverly Sills in that she is willing to sacrifice vocal beauty to serve
the drama. She stirs your soul.  coloraturafan 1 year ago in reply to primohomme I think your reply is proof enough who
is "mad." Opera is a great art form, and brings joy to many people.
However, dealing with "mad" fans like yourself is boring and to use your
words "rediculous... Stupid" and yes you "lack good taste" so I have
nothing further to add. I made my point and your reply made yours.  gustopheles 1 year ago in reply to LohengrinTh Hey, totally unrelated, but remember
that 1952 Macbeth video you posted of Callas singing "evil coloratura"?
What is the name of the track? Thanks!  Daniel Ramírez de Gastón 1 year ago in reply to primohomme You surely have NOT EVEN AN IDEA of
what coloratura really is! It isn’t just high notes, it’s a symbol of
greatness, magnificence, and splendor in Opera! You just need to stop
commenting, even though if it’s your own video, you are disgusting and a
true ignorant!  Whirled Publishing 1 year ago in reply to MisterSoprano You make a good point. Hallstein sings
with gorgeous precision and clarity while Gruberova sings with
passionate thrilling emotion.  PopoliDiTessalia 1 year ago There is no suprise: Frau Hallstein is
far more at ease in this repertory. I do think that she comes close to
technical perfection (perhaps just as Korjus did before). When Gruberova
can be interesting, Hallstein is just magical.
Thank you very much primohomme for this video.
Julien primohomme 1 year ago in reply to Gcourt91 Well, I’ve also heard her go off pitch
on other notes, such as her studio "Norma" in which "Casta Diva" has
those high B’s leading to the high C quite off pitch.  Elizabeth Smith 1 year ago Ingeborg Hallstein’s voice is very
melodic and has such lovely expression! I had always been a great fan
of Miliza Korjus, but this lady has a much nicer sound than both Miliza
Korjus and Edita Gruberova! Love, Liz coloraturafan 1 year ago in reply to primohomme You’re right I did make a video
comparing Devia and Fleming, and then one comparing Devia, Fleming,
Caballe and Callas. While I did that I never made nasty jokes about
Flemings fans, and I certainly don’t make homophobic or other tasteless
jokes about her fans. But you are also correct that I probably took your
joke too seriously and too personally, when it was never intended as
such. But I didn’t through a hissy fit, I expressed my view and that was
all. Slaychelle 1 year ago in reply to edgeofevolution I was referring to the first few clips
in the video...Gruberova isolated each note more in the earlier clips
in the video compared to Hallstein. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to IloveArethaFranklin Well, 3 things she did:
1- She dared say that roles like Lady Macbeth, Norma, Anna Bolena were
totally wrong for Maria Callas’ voice and she didn’t sing them well.
2- She said "if people applaud me less than 20 minutes, it bothers me"
3- She sings the Assoluta roles, that only a voice like Callas’ could
handle, without the power or (low register) range to do them justice,
making a ridicule of herself everytime she attempted them. But her rabid
fans and her age protect her from the booing. gustopheles 1 year ago Really surprising, though, that Hallstein’s lowermost tones are so well supported. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to Tuxster3 You are so dumb it is amusing. That
powerbottom came to MY video, so why should he block me on MY video. You
idiot.
And no g3rl, I know for a fact that I am handsome, you wish you could
have a face like mine. Have several seats. But please, not on my dick,
your ass is too loose and I don’t wanna catch an STD.  John DV 1 year ago As far as I can tell from youtube,
Hallstein is incomparable in slow, delicate, stratospheric coloratura.
She is not first-class when it comes to negotiating precise, rapid
passagework as found in Mozart. It is probably no accident that she
takes her Proch Variations at almost half the speed of (the
incomparable) Beverly Hoch. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak Why are you so upset though? I can feel your rage, it’s hillarious.
The clip you sent me of Edita’s "coppia iniqua" is obvious close-miking, so you cannot dare accuse Hallstein of that.
Here’s a pirated recording which shows truly how her middle-low sounds for the audience: /watch?v=ez_DOgUWzis
Besides the transpositions up an octave, do you hear the asthmatic quality of the low notes?  FrozenFurie 1 year ago How do you rate Grace Bumbry primohomme? LohengrinTh 1 year ago in reply to primohomme ah she has created a mass
hallucination for her and her courtyard and they actually believe all
that shit? didnt Bellini wrote Norma for Pasta and Malibran? who both
were dramatic voices? is she crazy?  Orfeus80 1 year ago in reply to primohomme Because that’s what I hear in the last
phrase ’il vostro il suo cor’ and the word partite before, for example.
Oh well, different voices, both unique.  Comment2013 1 year ago in reply to 2010thevoice Thank you for all your effort in
crafting this fine video. I learned a lot. Gruberova is a wonderful
singer, but you show Hallstein’s incredible skill in the upper register.
You’ve helped me to include Hallstein among those I can appreciate.
You have my gratitude, Primo.  지나가던 어린이 1 year ago what song they singing? primohomme 1 year ago in reply to MisterPapageno scooped high notes, hollow middle and ashtmatic non existant low = more homogenous voice? LMAO  newhere66 1 year ago Gruberova is THE Legend, but Hallstein is from Heaven :)))) edgeofevolution 1 year ago This discussion just proves my point.
High-note whores are the WORST stans. No matter the technical flaws, the
wobble, the non-existent sound in the middle and in the lower register,
the vocal struggle... The whole point of an aria being well sung is
hitting the E-flats, the Es, the Fs... regardless of how tense and
off-pitch they are. MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to BZBlaner Nice try. LohengrinTh 1 year ago in reply to primohomme actually i have heard only about lady M, she had said the same for callas’ norma? she is indeed a psychiatric case well hidden primohomme 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak Wasn’t I 100% fair in the comparisons
of this video? Didn’t I use exactly the same arias in the exactly same
segments and simply put them next to each other? You are getting upset,
pressed and suicidal because your fave is getting read for filth and
that’s all there is to it. I didn’t pick Gruberova’s "worst", I picked
what she has recorded and put out and compared it to what Ingeborg has
recorded and put out in the same repertoire, that’s all. #DEALWITHIT  dehradunwallah 1 year ago in reply to coloraturafan Coloratura, everybody here knows
you’re really fond of coloratura singing, and I for 1 really love the
videos you’ve been posting. Please don’t stop and thank you for every
single minute of the time you "wasted" on youtube gustopheles 1 year ago At 4:07 though, that "ya-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha" of Hallstein’s is a bit wanky MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to primohomme Oh but he IS a psychopath. I’m not
stalking, his trail is very easy to find online. He’s a homophobe.
misogynist, and psychotic. And you, primohomme...OCD. Obsessive
compulsive disorder. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak And for all you talk about Callas
(which you Gruberova fans have always hated, since she herself has
talked against Callas), unless you were Callas’ recording engineer, you
have absolutely no idea what went on into those recordings. But one
thing is I’m certain, Callas did not go off pitch as often as Edita in
her prime.  ilovecookies903 1 year ago in reply to Tosycyzkiewicy Hahhaha yes.  gaspar romano 1 year ago in reply to primohomme yessssssssss siiiiiiiiii MegaOperafreak 1 year ago 2. Hallstein’s sound was very sweet
and light, and it couldn’t sing declamatory passages with any weight or
substance. She had perfect pitch, and her control was exemplary. The
recording medium was ideal for documenting her voice. She declined to
sing Queen of the Night and Sophie at the MET because Hallstein wisely
knew the space would swallow her voice up. She was charm personified in
comedy and opeetta, beautiful to look at, but tragedy was beyond her
means.  Edson J. Cornejo 1 year ago I don’t even have to listen to the video. Gruberova is the Queen of coloratura. Period.  Theron Framboise 1 year ago JOAN SUTHERLAND!!!!  Kevin Salgado 1 year ago in reply to John DV es ingeborg is the best primohomme 1 year ago in reply to asdfopera Soon soon ;) dealing with finals week right now :P
Still compiling for it ;) MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to primohomme And I wish you luck in your career.
May you never be subjected to the vindictive ugliness you and your
fellow haters have shown on here, and elsewhere. Take care.  RicharddtheStar 1 year ago I’ve never really liked edita. Always considered her flawed as an opera singer. BZBlaner 1 year ago in reply to Daniel Ramírez de Gastón Coloratura is a means of EXPRESSION
you idiot. There’s a reason why composers such as Rossini, Donizetti
etc. wrote it in specific arias and left it out in others. FrozenFurie 1 year ago I don’t see how this video is
disrespecting Gruberova in any way. It’s just pointing out her flaws in a
very subtle manner. In fact, he even compliments her sometimes.
Some of you need to get a grip primohomme 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak Really? Here’s Lehmann’s "Casta Diva": /watch?v=3NUyCMF67jc
I didn’t hear any scooping to that Db6...
Here’s her "Martern aller Arten": /watch?v=X4oVE1MMtww
Here’s her "Ach ich liebte": /watch?v=s6h9X0Rmm7c
I didn’t hear anyting that sounds like a scooped high note...mmmmhmmm. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak Actually, I’m getting my masters in a
music related field right now, so yes...I can read and write music quite
well :) I also play several instruments.
Now, can you read scores? I advice you go look up the score of Anna
Bolena and Norma and Roberto Devereux and count out all the notes
Gruberova either scoops, sings with the wrong marking, or delivers
"parlando" or "sotto voce" instead of "maestoso". Slaychelle 1 year ago Gruberova has more clarity and really
defined each note with the ultimate precision but I prefer Hallstein’s
darker, heavier sound Slaychelle 1 year ago Wow, who knew opera stans were worse than the pop queens?
I’m done. I can’t X________X MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to primohomme Ever notice too that Hallstein sings passages on the German "ja"?  Tosycyzkiewicy 1 year ago in reply to BZBlaner In fact vibratoless top notes is a
great advantage of coloratura sopranos. The less vibrato in light high
coloraturas the better impression they make on me. They should be airy
and witty, like a delicate piccolo flute. MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to LohengrinTh Hey psychopath. How are you? Found some interesting information. Want me to publish it? MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to primohomme Just a suggestion. If you want to be a
scholar with intelligent discussions on here, you need to ban bzblaner,
simionato and lohengrin from your page. My son is a singer, and these
kinds of freaktards are the kinds every artist avoids as if they were
the black death. Hatred or fawning adoration at the expense of another
is verboten. An artist will ruin their own reputation speaking ill of
another singer or a colleague. MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to primohomme Sorry, but you’re wrong. Hallstein’s
Elettra arias are still light and pretty - and closely microphoned. You
don’t know what you’re talking about. There is no one is Europe you
will convince that Hallstein had a better lower register. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to Anna Hemming Soprano The natural tendency is to sing the
high notes louder and the low notes no so much, so singing strong low
notes as well as strong and agile, easy high notes is rare... BZBlaner 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak Yes we know that retarded spectacle is
still being discussed amongst Edita’s 80 fans :) Outside this stupid
Slovak’s hen house, no one really cares! MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to primohomme Gruberova has no technical flaws in
her execution of the music. She has pitch issues, and the production of
breath falters here and there. If you can read music, I suggest you
follow the scores as she is singing. Gruberova is one of the very few
singers who does not drop words in favor of aspirated scales in her
passagework. Notice how most coloraturas aspirate up to their concluding
E flats? Or aspirate to the upper interval? Or sing coloratura passages
with an ’h’ preceding the vowel? primohomme 1 year ago in reply to agators212 makes perfect sense ;) BZBlaner 1 year ago What amazes me the most of her idiotic
stans is how they consider her scoops a "portamento" LOL. Yes, yes ...
Rossini, Bellini and Donizetti wrote that vocal ornament under every
pitch ... MEEEEOWWWWWW!  Gcourt91 1 year ago I always found it strange that in A
LOT of her recordings, even in her prime, her E natural was flat. Scoops
notwithstanding, her Ebs, Fs and even higher were usually (eventually)
in tune. Maybe it’s something with her hearing or she has a passagio
there? Idk what kind of a flaw that is. Cry of Soul 1 year ago Wonderful video. I love your pedagogical and comparaison videos ^^ ! They are so well done and delighting. Gcourt91 1 year ago in reply to primohomme She keeps uncovering new bel canto
secrets! First, she showed us that La Straniera was the first true
atonal composition. Now, perhaps she is right again and makes clear that
Bellini intended lower notes to sound hollow, dry and muffled/barked.
Gruberova might be a misunderstood musical genius. asdfopera 1 year ago i know this is a comparison, but i think it is very close. imo this video just shows how both singers are great. coloraturafan 1 year ago in reply to coloraturafan (cont.) To explain my point a little
more clearly, I do like high notes, but that is not an exclusive or
limiting factor to my enjoyment of opera. I recently saw Didonato in
Maria Stuarda, and I was amazed at her wonderful performance. She is
currently one of my favorite singers, and without a doubt she is my
favorite Maria Stuarda. I still enjoy Sills and Sutherland in the role,
but I do love and enjoy the lower voice of Didonato. And I love a lot of
other singers.... (cont.) Voodoo Manman 1 year ago Après que j’ai comparé la voix de Gruberova, la voix de Hallstein est hyper rauque coloraturafan 1 year ago in reply to primohomme "her gays" I guess Gruberova’s only
fans are "gays" is that what you mean? What a homophobic and stupid
comment to make. Pandering to the lowest common denominator, typical and
ridiculous behavior. coloraturafan 1 year ago in reply to primohomme hmm, a jock with pretty purple eyes,
how nice! Anyhow, I hardly need anyone to come and defend me. What
others say and do is beyond my control. However, you say that I never
presented a counter argument, and that is not true. My first comment
here was that you were making homophobic remarks. And you have tried to
twist that into a battle over who’s taste in music is "better" or more
"educated" and who is more stereotypical based on their taste in
music.... (cont.) jmiller05 1 year ago Listening to this again, it’s just
bizarre and dissapointing how inherent Gruberova’s scooping was in her
singing. Even in the late 70’s, her performances of Lucia have notable
scooping in them, which shows that even her fresh, agile voice was
incapable of pure intonation.
Scooping is so bad musically to listen to too. It’s like someone burping
before a note.  CloudOfReverie 1 year ago The end LOL  Chimier C 1 year ago in reply to BZBlaner She still has her HIGH NOTES though!
QUEEN of COLORATURA!!!!!! She deserves nothing but 20-minute plus
standing O’s. Any less, and it’ll bother her.
LMAOOO. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to LohengrinTh LMAO, well...I think she was good in 2
out of the 3 arias for Konstanze. She definitely didn’t have the low
notes to sing "Martern aller Arten". And you are right, she scoops even
in her Zerbinetta.  Get off my video Don’t come back 1 year ago in reply to primohomme O have heard Hallstein on other
videos, and her tones are never as full as Gruberova’s, nor does she
sing with much feeling. Hallstein reminds me of the mechanical doll in
"The Tales of Hoffman". Chimier C 1 year ago in reply to primohomme It’s a sad day when high notes are equated with music lol.  Rômulo Rocha 1 year ago 9:40 - LMAO Typical of her. Chimier C 1 year ago 8:28-8:34- How dreadful LOL! Chimier C 1 year ago in reply to BZBlaner All the tonality sucked out of it like
fat out stomach during lipo.
"Ah well, an E-flat is still an E-flat! Gruberova is truly the
queen...no, EMPRESS of the bel canto high tones"- High-note whore. LohengrinTh 1 year ago in reply to primohomme and you know, the ultimate test for a
singer is.. do u listen to her? do u want to listen to her? do u turn on
the tube and search for her recordings or u are forced to listen to her
by your friends in order to make fun of her? Gruba is definitely the
I-never-listen-to-her-anymore category  colombe paula 1 year ago Sublime vidéo ***** merci beaucoup  Devotedlamb19 1 year ago Hallstein clearly. Although Gruberova had some splendid moments in this video. LohengrinTh 1 year ago in reply to primohomme biggest flaw? worse than her scoop?
very mediocre musicianship.. you are never interested to hear her
interpretation of an aria.. even bigger? complete lack of interpretation LohengrinTh 1 year ago in reply to primohomme You mean Costanze and Zerbinetta? hm.. just count the Miaaauuuuus in the there and you will reconsider gustopheles 1 year ago It bums me out how much worse Edita sounded in the recording studio than live. gustopheles 1 year ago in reply to primohomme Primohomme, I’ve been a huge Gruberova
fan for years so I know all about how terrible she is lol. But I own a
bunch of her studio recordings, and she sounds considerably worse on
those records than she does live. For example, in her live 1990 Tokyo
"Bell Song", she sounds 100 times better than the studio version here.
Both of the E6’s are scooped, but the pitch, the breath, and the legato
are stunning. Chimier C 1 year ago in reply to Get off my video Don’t come back "To me Gruberova is the better singer, more musicianly"- LMAO. edgeofevolution 1 year ago Gruby’s "Ma Che Vi Fece, O Stelle" was simply awful :/  sttar1982 1 year ago HALLSTEIN®  Devonte Lampkin 1 year ago Hallstein  OperaMyWorld 1 year ago in reply to primohomme Yes she has not good low notes and the
scooping is really annoying sometimes!!But the phrase "much more worked
voice" was for technich such as trills for example...I’m sorry that
maybe I can not fully express my self in english...hope not to be
missundertood... edgeofevolution 1 year ago Hallstein. No high-note whoring, no scooping, no wobble nor drops of support. And she actually has a lower voice. Rômulo Rocha 1 year ago What an amazing video! I loved!
From the clips that you’ve picked by Gruberova, I can see that she’s not
a bad singer. She’s actually a good singer. But when compared to the
immaculate perfection of Hallstein as a lyric coloratura soprano, the
other lady is not feeding the thirst of vocal perfection. MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to BZBlaner Her DVD of Norma is one of the
bestselling worldwide in DG’s history. I have a friend who is in the
manufacturing division of the company, and they could not make them fast
enough to keep them stocked when it was first released. What do you
make of that, you ugly dumb fuck? (Yes, I’ve seen pictures of you) asdfopera 1 year ago i love the first 75 seconds of this video!  theTrekkie007 1 year ago Thank you for uploading this video :)
it’s so... Amazing! :D
Anyway, I loved Edita’s expression in many passages, but I think I
eventually prefer Hallenstein, for her way of singing, so clear and
crystalline :)
(of course, in my case it is just a matter of taste lol)  Goldenlowen 1 year ago in reply to primohomme You have her Mozart album? I am seething with jealousy right now. :( coloraturafan 1 year ago in reply to primohomme You know nothing about me or my
knowledge of music or opera. As for you telling me that I "don’t get to
speak" about opera, well in fact I do... and I would bet that more
people would listen to what I have to say than you.... if I look again
how many people actually watch your videos???? ilovecookies903 1 year ago Hallstein has one of the best voices I’ve ever heard. <3 primohomme 1 year ago in reply to LohengrinTh The logic of many of them is that
Grisi also sang Norma, and according to them since the one role Bellini
wrote for her was Elvira in "I Puritani" which is a lyric-coloratura
role, she must have been a lyric voice. But critics from that time wrote
she was a dramatic voice, and the part of Adalgisa goes down to low A.
So...
Also, Adelina Patti sang "Norma" and "Semiramide", but it’s said she
only did it in piano concert (instead of with full orchestra) and
ornamenting up an octave on low notes.  MusikPiratCH 1 year ago Here I like Hallstein more! Clearer voice, more easy notes and does not press at all! Get off my video Don’t come back 1 year ago To me Gruberova is the better singer, more musicianly. But I certainly admire Hallstein. BZBlaner 1 year ago in reply to primohomme Stop bullying coloraturashit. He’s gonna release Coloratura Craziness Deluxe Edition. BZBlaner 1 year ago in reply to Chimier C LOL, and do you know what also bothers
me? A wobble, dreadful intonation, non-existent middle tones, airy low
chest notes, scooping - all of which that mummified hag’s larynx does
and encompasses! LohengrinTh 1 year ago in reply to primohomme to be honest i always thought of her
costanze as flawless but i never truly listened to her with my late ears
which have developed a miau-apostrophy.. her top notes were never as
free as hallstein and the big secred is that her live Queen of the Night
sucked! Her zerbinetta, even in munich in 1983 was an endless array of
Miaus (especially in the two F6#s where the draging of voice is
ridiculous)
After all these years I do listen to Hallstein from t ime to time, I
never listen to the Gruba  Francisco Spears 1 year ago Britney is the queen of colocatura !!!!!!  Anna Hemming Soprano 1 year ago I really liked Gruberova’s bell song, I
think her voice sounded more resonant than Hallstein who sounds a bit
"tweety" & metallic. Hallstein is much, MUCH more precise though and
her acuti are like nothing else I have ever heard, it is really
supernatural. Not sure why she puts a "y" sound at the beginning of
phrases (if we’re going to be really picky!). I don’t understand about
"well-supported" low notes, don’t they just sing themselves? That’s the
only part that I think is easy! ;) MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to primohomme There is no dropping of support. The
vocal color changes: it’s what nature gave her. The pitch issues she
has are due to her faulty ear, which she has publicly admitted to. She
declined to sing Lulu for that reason, stating that reason. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to coloraturafan Far less stereotypical than
worshipping vocal gymnastics and high notes for the sake of vocal
gymnastics and high notes ;)
You obviously cannot see it now, but promoting canaries whose only solid
sound is around high C is not helping the art of opera but turning it
into a joke where transposing and rewriting the vocal line for sake of
the high note is the habit. At least when I become obsessed with a
certain coloratura singer, she also has a solid middle voice (for her
voice type). Edson J. Cornejo 1 year ago in reply to Edson J. Cornejo The video is very tendentious by the way! :P MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to primohomme 3. Hallstein herself was chagrined at
the size of her voice, and the limited color of it. It was one of the
reasons she retired so early. The Callas recording manipulations is an
inside industry knowledge. If you listen to the latest remastering of
her forza recording, you can actually hear the multitudes of splicings.
I don’t hate anybody, least of all singers. Finally; a great artist
does not always do things by a conventional book. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to Chimier C You know her fans don’t care if she butches the music, as long as she ends on a big scooped, tense high note :) primohomme 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak Dropping the support as she comes down
the scale is a technical flaw. Scooping (not always, but often) is a
technical flaw. Occasional pitch issues is another technical flaw.
Talking the low passages instead of singing them is another technical
flaw, etc.
Anyway, my point wasn’t to be malicious towards Gruberova, if that were
my point I could have used a very ugly picture of her and some terrible
recordings of her. My point was to respond to some of her fans who were
trash-talking Hallstein.  Ria Brezova 1 year ago Edita Gruberova is queen of coloratura !!! Tosycyzkiewicy 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak Singing ha-ha on high notes is a terrible vice of many sopranos. I greatly appreciate the care about the well pronounced text. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to OperaMyWorld Saying the truth is awful? I mean,
let’s be honest, refering to someone as "stupid gay" is not an insult if
it’s the truth. A big chunk of the fans of the divas is gay, that’s a
fact, and many get so emotionally involved with their divas that behave
in very stupid ways, that’s another fact. Slaychelle 1 year ago Hallstein is flawless! primohomme 1 year ago in reply to John DV That’s simply not true. I have her
Mozart album and it’s fantastic, every note is sung perfectly in tune,
and in many of the German/Austrian coloratura recordings she has the
coloratura is unbelievably virtuosic. BZBlaner 1 year ago OMG, you decided to treat us with Grubby’s gremlin photo ...
Hallstein in every aspect of vocalism: High notes, middle, lower voice, dynamics, articulation, coloratura technique etc. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to Anna Hemming Soprano Hallstein sang with a "yah"
articulation starting her scales in order to avoid doing glottal stops.
It’s just a certain bel canto technique used to preserve the high notes,
as glottal stops can tire the voice if overdone.
The low notes require just as much support and resonance as high notes,
thinking they don’t is how someone like Gruberova dares sing roles like
"Norma", "Anna Bolena", Elizabeth in "Roberto Devereux", etc without
having any low chest tones. MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to primohomme Further, if scooping were so much an
issue with you, how about your darling Callas and her scooping in the
puritani recording, other times flatted wobbly notes. You have any idea
how much "fixing" went on in her studio recordings? Speeded-up tape to
correct flat high notes, splices to erase wobbles. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to TheZenomeProject Musik Except that Gruberova is (was) genuinely a great singer (in certain roles)  baroquealmaviva 1 year ago Hallstein, obviously. I just can’t
with Gruberova. Her singing has always sounded somewhat quite sloppy to
my ears. Especially compared to Hallstein, who’s the epitome of a
stratospheric soprano. Just can’t compare... Oh! One can’t forget
’musicianship’, because Hallstein is the kind of musician that Grubie
could never dream of being! primohomme 1 year ago And OMG Gruby’s hairdressers are already showing up giving thumbs down to this video :P  zeissfan06 1 year ago Ingeborg Hallstein. LMAO at those clips in the end XD  Maranedy 1 year ago :D
hahahahaha.... more love for Ingeborg Hallstein [my newfound love after damrau]  TheZenomeProject Musik 1 year ago Hallstein’s technique is clearly more
refined, it just shows because of her utterly perfect intonation and
complete ease in the extreme upper register. She also shows FAR better
support in the middle voice. I don’t quite get this video, however. Is
this the operatic equivalent of an XTina/Beyonce stan war? primohomme 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak Popularity, fame, etc do not equal
great singing. Edita is great in some roles, but in the roles she has
chosen to sing in the last 15 years she is beyond dreadful.
If you had actually seen Gruberova and Hallstein live, you must be in
your 70’s by now, is that the case? I don’t believe it.
I’ve heard some live recordings by Hallstein that prove she was able to
project the middle and lower area very well live, unlike Gruberova.
Here’s an example:
/watch?v=qdYFqidjMPg MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to primohomme 2. Gruberova aspirates less than any
coloratura I have ever heard. It’s why she has that "different" attack
method, which sounds like scooping (sometimes it actually is), but she
carrying the vowel (the purity of it) to, and up to, the next note
without aspirating up. It’s not everyone’s cup of tea. If you go back
to the *really* early recordings, those of Plancon. Patti, Sembrich,
Lehmann, you hear this pronounced, un-aspirated lift up, carrying the
vowel without a breathy h attack. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to asdfopera Wanna help? I need Edita’s studio Lucrezia Borgia and Beatrice di Tenda :P  spenzur 1 year ago Damn you people all need to calm down. This is crazy. BZBlaner 1 year ago in reply to primohomme All her stans are a ridicule to opera
and classical music. Circumventing musical masterpieces just so the
retards can get their fix with the E-flat at the end of an aria. asdfopera 1 year ago in reply to primohomme that should be interesting. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to coloraturafan Well, my point is simple: I think that
promoting such emphasis on high notes and coloratura somehow imprints
into less knowlegable people that opera is just high note fetishm. For
example your advocacy of Gruberova and Devia in a role like Lucrezia
Borgia as opposed to Renee Fleming, when neither Gruberova nor Devia
have ever been able to support at both extremes the 2+ octave range
required for such a role. As in bel canto the most important thing is a
solid middle, not the extreme high notes. Devonte Lampkin 1 year ago I just knew I would all three of you here. The Vocal Critique Giants of Youtube! Lemme perch! LohengrinTh 1 year ago in reply to IloveArethaFranklin she was never amazing.. Pro ears were
mentioning her huge flaws long before today.. but because she was
singing German coloratura mostly no one cared about her..when she began
singing the bel canto repertoire, the Travesty of her voice became more
than obvious and we just focused on her vocal flaws. Because of her
little microcosmos her fans have built around her the greatest Scooper
of all times believes she was a master of bel canto.. the truth is she
is atrocious in bel canto primohomme 1 year ago in reply to LohengrinTh her gays tell her that, and you know...she gets upset when her gays applaud less than 20 minutes. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to coloraturafan Let me list the queeny stereotypical things you’ve done so far:
- You come here and throw a fit because your fave is criticized
- You feel personally insulted though your name was never brought up
- You send the video to your fellow fans and invite them to come over like rabid vermin and attack
- You use your very many duplicate accounts to thumb up your own comments and thumb down those you dislike.
See how hysterical that behavior is? Last time I saw that was in "The birdcage". Read more primohomme 1 year ago in reply to Maranedy Damrau? Ew. LohengrinTh 1 year ago in reply to gustopheles for me the only real quality in
grubarova’s voice is that her vocal line is not exactly thick but you
cannot call it thin either.. all the rest sucks.. the singing technique
was a huge Miau, the lower and middle voice non existant, the assoluta
roles she sang were all dreadfuly sung and her character is what I call a
"hidden nasty bitch".. She will be remembered only for her Costanze and
Zerbinetta and those roles ended 20 years ago Anna Hemming Soprano 1 year ago in reply to primohomme if you do a humming or "ng" exercise
from bottom to top, the need for body support does increase as you go
upwards, but it’s true they need resonance. These guys would probably
have a good laugh at my high notes, but I can’t understand why blasting
out a low A is that hard! oh well.. Not sure why a high light voice
would attempt those roles at all, when they should be dramatic soprano,
or mezzo. And those singers wldn’t have the purity & flexibility to
do this - everyone’s different! :) BZBlaner 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak LMAO, you’re such a pressed bitch. Now
let’s compile a list of Gruberova’s voice amateurisms: coloratura
technique with a disgusting yodelling quality; attacking high notes
either through scooping or pianissimo; vibratoless top notes; shaky
intonation over her entire range; mushy articulation; excessive and
swallowed pianissimi tones; no middle voice; no lower voice; vulgar
mannerisms; legato singing disjointed with a million clicks and scoops.
And then the five good notes: C6, C#6, D6, Eb6, E6.  MrPharaoh62 1 year ago As many countries as many queens. In
Australia they considered Sutherland to be their queen of coloratura.
Here, in Ukraine, we would probably name Miroshnichenko etc. It is my
strong belief it’s useless comparing the singers. For the Gruberova fans
she will always be the queen. For me the most important thing is the
timbre of my favorite singer. Maybe, she’s not the best in the world at
vocal pyrotechincs (term used by Antonio Pappano), but I don’t care. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak And lastly, when it comes to me, nice
to see you are following my singing now, but let me ask you, can you
mention a single male vocalist that can sing pop, rock, opera and has a
baritonal color as well as a high extension to soprano AND a whistle
register? I’ll wait... MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to primohomme So here’s what you’re going to do:
you’ll pick Sutherland’s best, Gruberova’s not so best, and make
baseless comparisons. Sutherland: one dynamic, no real pianissimi,
aspirates sprinkled throughout, words dropped in scale passages,
terrible pronunciation, phrases not tapered off, shadings beyond her
abilities, high notes scooped up to, lurching downward portamenti. And
one of the greatest natural voices of all time. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to gustopheles You might have a point, because I
always thought in 2 out of the 3 arias as Konstanze she sings better
live than in the studio recordings. BZBlaner 1 year ago in reply to Chimier C And her E-flat nowadays is also quite dreadful - usually under pitch, lacks vibrato. Mhmmm. coloraturafan 1 year ago in reply to coloraturafan (cont.).... You keep trying to turn my
words around to fit some stereotype that you feel about people who
enjoy high voices and coloratura singing. Your argument seems to be that
if a person enjoyes coloratura singing they cannot enjoy opera, or at
least "serious" opera. And that coloratura singers ruin the integrity of
the artform. You could not be further from reality, at least in my
opinion.... (cont.) primohomme 1 year ago in reply to theTrekkie007 :) primohomme 1 year ago in reply to LohengrinTh LMAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!
Exactly. I was wondering how his comments would get 10 thumbs up in a matter of 20 minutes. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to Get off my video Don’t come back Really? Gruberova is the better musician even with the scooping, under pitch notes here and there, etc? How very... primohomme 1 year ago in reply to coloraturafan And for the record, I am not a twink,
I’m a jock. And I would tell you the same things to your face, that your
hysterics are ridiculous and very stereotypical (throwing a hissy fit
because your fave was criticized, calling all your girlfriends to come
defend you, acting like a victim, etc). The difference is that then,
without your girlfriends to come defend you, what would you do? You
would either run like you saw the devil, or you would have to actually
come up with a logical counter argument. Chimier C 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak "You have any idea how much "fixing"
went on in her studio recordings?"- You were Callas’ recording engineer?
Oooooh. Do tell. *waits* Chimier C 1 year ago in reply to BZBlaner But hey, according to the high-note
whores and coloraSLUTS, none of that matters as long as the High Eb and
above is still in that TROAT. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to Theron Framboise That’s for a second video ;) primohomme 1 year ago in reply to asdfopera They both wobbled in the middle, but
Joan didn’t sing off pitch even in her very last performances. Also,
Joan could project 2 octaves of more or less solid sound, poor Edita
only has the notes above E5. BZBlaner 1 year ago in reply to Get off my video Don’t come back Gruberova reminds me of dog shit to be honest: musically retarded and technically incompetent. coloraturafan 1 year ago in reply to primohomme I never sent the video to anyone. I
don’t pretend to be a victim, but when I see comments that are out of
line, I’ll say something, and that is what I’ve done. As for your
referring to yourself as a "bitch" now who is the stereotypical one,
"sweetheart"? edgeofevolution 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak Music and vocal pedagogy are sciences. They aren’t up to opinions. Gruberova has immense flaws in her singing. Tosycyzkiewicy 1 year ago Ingeborg Hallstein and Florence
Jenkins are the queens of coloratura. Hallstein for the voice and
musicality, Jenkins for the right attitude to operatic singing.  Ariadne7710 1 year ago No need to ask. Hallstein hands down.
Not to say that Gruberova in her prime was not great (unlike the
current sad shadow of her once great self) but Hallstein on top of great
coloratura technique has instinctive musicality so whatever she sings
sounds not only technically perfect but wonderfully musical as well. OperaMyWorld 1 year ago Gruberova for sure!!Her voice is much
more worked on details as trills for example...Hallstein had excellent
High notes but sounds to me like her approach on singing generally was
little "Cold"...Gruberova is a better coloratura...It is not only a High
F...but also there are the coloring of a phrase, the trills and
generally the bel canto embelliments!! MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to primohomme Dreadful in YOUR opinion. You base her
singing on how Callas and others sang, and that’s your fallacious
drawback. Your own singing is derivative, and don’t have a style of
your own.  Rosannasfriend 1 year ago hey primohomme! This is an interesting
video. I just want to say that everyone should calm down, its only
singing at the end of the day, although we all love and are all
passionate about it. I appreciate being introduced to these coloratura
singers, as I’ve recently started getting more into opera. Keep up the
good work! And just block people who bother you. :))))) IloveArethaFranklin 1 year ago Hallstein or Dessay ???  reginabellestar 1 year ago Hallstein Chimier C 1 year ago Hallstein is CLEARLY the superior
vocalist and musician. No scooping, no shrieking, just divine abilities,
like her frighteningly accurate intonation and pin-point coloratura.
Her voice is like crystal glass. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to 2010thevoice Cecilia Bartoli OperaMyWorld 1 year ago in reply to primohomme Such a shame because I adore your work...and your words are just awful as your soul... MegaOperafreak 1 year ago 3. Gruberova, on the other hand, was a
vocal miracle from the start. Zerbinetta had never before been sung
with such a full, generous sound, nor sung with such brilliance,
sauciness and technical precision. The voice got larger as the years
went on. She has the same vocal methodology and placement as Nilsson
(of course not having the size), frontal, resonant and penetrating.
Contrary to what primohomme keeps insisting, Gruberova has a
well-developed mittelage that carries well. Ariadne7710 1 year ago Hallstein hands down!!! Her clarity,
precision, musicality are second to none and the way she leaps into the
stratosphere with such pin point accuracy, with no adjustments, no
scooping, no sliding, no screeching or any other devices to get there.
Incredible vocal agility without losing expressiveness. LohengrinTh 1 year ago in reply to Gcourt91 the low notes were intended not to be sung at all but rather be transposed upwards..
A mental retard gruberova was and a pathological envier of Callas PopoliDiTessalia 1 year ago In my humble opinion, Edita Gruberova
is an excellent coloratura soprano, but she remains a singer. And the
fact is that Ingeborg Hallstein, as you wrote, dear primohomme, sings
the most diffficult parts with as much ease as if she was talking. In
other worlds, while listening to Gruberova, you can hear her school
years... and when you listen to the divine Hallstein, you hear something
which appears to be totally natural and spontaneous.
Anyway, many many thanks for the post, primohomme,
Julien LohengrinTh 1 year ago Of all my remarks for Gruberova my
favorite is the following: Her face while she is singing looks like
someone placed a pile of shit underneath her nose and the expression of
disgust got stuck there permanently.. and that is an "artistic
expression" ahahhahahahahah
Mentally retarded sopranos, mentally retarded fans!  Christina Aguilera TV 1 year ago brilliant musicianship OperaMyWorld 1 year ago in reply to primohomme For me I adore many many Divas over
the time with my top fav La Callas!Gruberova is not the best but I can
hear her singing and enjoy it...that seems that?? I dont like all these
comments...and I tell you that I like your videos very much and it is
shame to see such a bad behaviour...I just find Gruberova’s voice more
medeteranian...just that...and speaking from my point of view everyone
who listen to the opera is not gay! So the "you are gay though" that you
are telling to me is rudeness! primohomme 1 year ago in reply to gustopheles I don’t think Hallstein is capable of making an "unattractive" sound.
But Gruberova does define the notes in her trills more.  Mary Lamb 1 year ago gruberovaAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA primohomme 1 year ago in reply to sachmetixchel Tu oido debe estar bastante mal, porque Hallstein en ningun momento desafina. Gcourt91 1 year ago in reply to LohengrinTh But what is more important in opera than high notes?!?! primohomme 1 year ago in reply to Orfeus80 The tessitura of a high
lyric-coloratura voice is Bb4-Bb5, and higher...so that’s where I
compared them :)
Eb4 is still very much middle voice, and it completely disappears in
Gruberova’s voice as she comes down that scale, so how can you claim she
keeps the a full sound? primohomme 1 year ago in reply to Cry of Soul Chimier has made many videos like that, go to his channel. asdfopera 1 year ago in reply to primohomme i think most divas take criticism better than fans. BZBlaner 1 year ago in reply to John DV Go listen to concert arias such ’Schon
lacht der holde Frühling’ and ’Ma che vi fece, o stelle’. Hallstein
negotiates the most demanding Mozart coloratura passages with consummate
ease, crushing all in her wake. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to Gcourt91 LMAO, you read her downE primohomme 1 year ago in reply to FrozenFurie I don’t follow her much, but I have
one album by her and she was quite good, I especially like her "O ma
lyra immortelle" and her scene from "il trovatore", I think she was a
Falcon voice. coloraturafan 1 year ago in reply to coloraturafan (cont.) and this is my last reply... I
think you misjusdge me because my SN is coloraturafan,I am a fan of all
types of singing and music. If you think I am a fan of bad singing,
that is fine, we all have our own opinion about what makes good singing.
However, I don’t appreciate seeing remarks like Gruberova’s "gays" and
so on. And when I see those comments I will remark that is my
personality. Just as I would say the same thing to your face if you made
that comment to me. OperaMyWorld 1 year ago in reply to coloraturafan I TOTTALLY AGREE WITH YOU!! I LOVE HER VOICE!! IS THAT MEAN THAT I AM GAY??PEOPLE write some CRAZY COMMENTS SOMETIMES!! asdfopera 1 year ago in reply to primohomme you really think sutherland was
singing better? by the time sutherland was in her 60s the voice was not
even recognizable compared to her great earlier recordings. gruberova
has retained much of the youthful qualities of her voice, but there is
considerable decline. she is not in her vocal prime, but arguably she
still has something left. i said arguably because obviously some people
do not agree. :)  Maarjaanaa 1 year ago two perfect, perfect! singers sachmetixchel 1 year ago la primera comparación y los
sobreagudos de Hallstein, son menos resonantes, aunque más bonitos :).
En la segunda ella misma pierde precisión, 2:31. En el aria de las
campanas, me encanta que haga adornos diferentes y Gruberova esas
coloraturas increíbles con precisión en cada nota! y Hallstein empieza a
cantarlas con "ia" :s. Conclusión: las dos son muy buenas de todas
maneras. LohengrinTh 1 year ago in reply to simionato6 she had said that Callas’ voice was
wrong for Lady Macbeth in an interview she had given in Athens in early
90s when she had come for a concert.. of course she never explained (how
to explain this stupidity) But now after all these years I finally
understand the pathological degree this woman hated and envied Callas
which is reflected on her fans MegaOperafreak 1 year ago 4. Unlike Hallstein, recording does
not serve Gruberova’s voice well, or accurately. The medium "flattens"
out the incredible overtones and projection quality of Gruberova’s tone.
In the house, the voice has an enveloping shine that, once you’ve
heard it, you never forget the mysterious way it ’surrounds’ your ears;
it’s almost as if the voice is being "thrown" at you, and it is
thrilling. As far as her style goes, so it goes. If what she was doing
was wrong, she wouldn’t have the acclaim.  MisterSoprano 1 year ago Why cannot we enjoy both? They both
great. And yes, some of the (specificly chosen) clips here show
Hallstein is more precize, but there were/are many of that kind of
voice coloratura singers, while Gruberova’s voice is unique. Don’t
missunderstand me please, I enjoy Hallstein very much, but Gruberova
thrils me more.  Drelnis 1 year ago in reply to coloraturafan I just want to say that your activity
on this site has been a great contribution in spreading the great art of
opera. I’m a student at one of America’s best conservatories now and I
wouldn’t be where I am if not for YouTube and especially not for what
you’ve contributed to it. Don’t let a few idiots let you down! coloraturafan 1 year ago in reply to primohomme You are referring to me as a
"powerbottom" really? Oh wow, you speak about how stereotypical you
think my behavior is because I enjoy coloratura singing. But your
comments are that of a stereotypical nasty bitchy queen, the kind I’ve
always avioded at all costs. I really have nothing left to say except,
if you ever see me at an event, I invite you to say these nasty things
to my face, because I would guess that you wouldn’t have the balls, I’m
not some purple eyed twink. LohengrinTh 1 year ago in reply to primohomme well they can say all the want..
Bellini wrote Norma for Pasta and Malibran the voices of whom were as
far different from Gruberova’s.
She really believes she was a credible Norma? she needs a psychiatrist primohomme 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak But I wasn’t hating on her...All I did
was make a video comparing her to Ingeborg Hallstein in the same exact
musical passages, and pointed out some of her technical flaws. And did
it in response to Gruberova fans claiming Ingeborg is absolutely no
good.
Hating is what you did, claiming Ingeborg is all close-miking and then
posting a link of a very close-miked Edita. Or claiming that you somehow
know all the secrets of the pitch correction that had to be done to
Callas. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to LohengrinTh She has said that Norma was written
for a voice like hers, not for a dramatic voice (which implies that
everybody with a big voice like Callas and Sutherland is wrong for the
role, according to her). MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to primohomme /watch?v=9rmH8b4QNUI
Hear her low notes - strong, firm. Accurate, words on the text. final
high note sung to a text - ’pie-TA’ - unlike all others, who sing ha-HA Orfeus80 1 year ago in reply to primohomme interestingly though, your comparison
focused mostly on the extremes and acrobatics of these two voices. The
middle of their range was not discussed and it’s exactly where
Hallstein’s acquires a rather husky unsupported sound especially evident
in the last example. Gruberova retains a full sound there. Just my two
cents, I’m a groupie of neither but admire them both and generally find
this type of vocal comparisons, collections of top Eflats etc very
boring. OperaMyWorld 1 year ago in reply to primohomme To speak in such manner to person that
you know, is your preference....but to person who don;t know
personally, it is bad...and I don’t like only "Divas"...I;m big Fan of
Pavarotti-Di Stefano-Del Monaco-Tagliavini and other great tenors...and I
just say my opinion...So why should I accept such an unjust attack? primohomme 1 year ago in reply to BZBlaner *DEAD*
Part 2 is coming up though. Edita v/s Joan, who is the real queen of bel canto ;) primohomme 1 year ago in reply to MisterPapageno And here I am comparing her to
Hallstein using only the high coloratura repertoire they both sang, not
the Assoluta repertoire. And even in this repertoire she scoops, lacks
support in the middle, and the low notes (the few there are) are non
existant. So how is that a homogenous voice? it’s not. jmiller05 1 year ago Hallstein has the richer voice, and
I’ve never heard her scoop and not take high notes and tones cleanly,
which is ironic considering Gruberova is the supposed Bel Canto
specialist :P
That said, Gruberova had some delightful facets to her voice. Airy,
dreamy piannisimo, limpid coloratura and bright beams for high notes.
Plus her trill was gorgeous.
It’s maybe a matter of taste. Both have incredible merits. I still can’t
quite forgive Edita for singing ’Norma’ though. Read more coloraturafan 1 year ago in reply to primohomme Okay so you are saying that calling me
a "fag" is not homophobic, reducing me to a sexual oriantation is not
homophobic? You obviously don’t understand what homophobia actually is.
As for my taste in music, I really don’t care if you agree or if you
think I have bad taste. That is totally subjective. As for "holding my
tits" once again you’ve just proven how low class you are. You say that
my behavior doesn’t speak well of my intelligence, but your behavior
speaks volumes about your character. MegaOperafreak 1 year ago Here’s the truth about Hallstein and
Gruberova. I have heard them both live. What you hear on recordings on
the part of Hallstein is an illusion. She had one of the tiniest
voices in opera. The mittelage didn’t carry in the house at all. The
highest tones floated out, but they didn’t spin. Her career lasted just
about 22 years. When middle age set in, the youthful timbre, the
natural "little girl" sound went away. LohengrinTh 1 year ago Hallstein attacked the notes so purely
and with such perfect intonation.. Grubarova hasnt reached one single
note in her entire life without passing through the previous tones..
Hallstein’s singing technique was flawless..
And ofc Hallstein never gone mental started singing the Assoluta
repertoire.. but for that I blame her Gays, they should have stopped
her.. it seems her Gays were even more ambitious than herself MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to primohomme I know something I’m not revealing :-)
Fun toying with you "both". Try as you might, you will not reduce
Gruberova no matter what you do. You think artistry comes down to
mechanical accuracy of single notes, and yet you cannot read scores. I
have been present in discussions with world-class singers and
conductors, and if you tried your BS about Gruberova with any of them,
you’d be laughed and scorned off the planet. You don’t get it - at all,
and you think you do. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to LohengrinTh Did you clock Gruberova’s flat E in the scoop at the end of her "bell song"? *giggles* Kevin Salgado 1 year ago Ingeborg Hallstein wins  WestVoice 1 year ago Hallstein indeed! :) LohengrinTh 1 year ago in reply to gustopheles Regna il sogno su tutti.. the ultimate
example of Callas’ ability to sing phrases with perfect legato and
musically complete while coloraturizing withing the phrases without the
slightest compromise of legato or of phrasing (this is for me the
unrepeatable phenomenon in callas) LohengrinTh 1 year ago in reply to primohomme the worst thing is that he actually believes the discussions he creates with himself :))) MegaOperafreak 1 year ago in reply to primohomme /watch?v=dhEA5JVMvSA I suggest you
listen/watch this performance of Roberto Devereux, primohomme, if you
want to get an idea of Gruberova at her best. Me and my wife attended
this performance 3 nights running and it is still being talked about
today. For all that you try - in vain - to diminish this great artist,
you cannot erase the record. You seem to have a fetish in spotlighting
and discrediting. May what goes around comes around.  jd7x7 1 year ago in reply to primohomme I am pleased to hear it. As I said, I
was going by youtube, and in the fast passagework I have heard Hallstein
negotiate (eg Queen of the Night) she has a hard time keeping precisely
on the beat. gustopheles 1 year ago in reply to LohengrinTh In fact, there is ONE video I’ve found
in which she attacked an E-flat dead on: in "Je Suis Titania" from a
1990 Tokyo concert. Apart from that, everything above C6 is always
scooped.
I will say, though, that her trill is beyond reproach. Far better than
Hallstein’s unattractive trill at 6:35. Cry of Soul 1 year ago in reply to primohomme Celine’s fails are not obvious for
everybody. What I meant is that you would done a video like this very
well. But, yes, it’s not particulary necessary :) ! I’m not particulary a
hater, but she’s so overrated. asdfopera 1 year ago in reply to primohomme where is part 2? :) primohomme 1 year ago in reply to OperaMyWorld You are right, it’s not just about the
high notes. But I don’t think someone who scoops the high notes and
does not support the middle and low register, a "much more worked
voice". coloraturafan 1 year ago in reply to simionato6 You’re a pig! Calling me a
Grubero-fag, your comments like the other homophobic shit I’ve read here
proves only what pathetic small minded people generate toward opera. It
is sadly an art that draws the lowest quality of trash to the surface. I
used to think YouTube was a great place for people to share in the art
of opera, now I wonder why I ever wasted my time here. Call me what you
want, you have proven you are nothing but trash! primohomme 1 year ago in reply to gustopheles Well, I’ve heard some pretty dreadful
stuff by her live. For example her "La sonnambula" is DREADFUL, I mean,
off pitch, off tempo, etc. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to coloraturafan Oh, so, you are saying that what you
say is truth because more people watch your channel? LMAO, that’s one of
the stupidest things I’ve read today, and considering the stupid things
your gay friends have posted on this video today, that’s saying a lot.
I didn’t question whatever knowledge you claimed to have, I questioned
your taste level. You see, liking tutus and slippers is not the same as
liking or understanding ballet. Same can be said about coloratura/high
notes and opera. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to Edson J. Cornejo It’s promoting the truth, that’s all.
Someone who scoops, goes flat, has no middle or low notes, etc cannot be
called "the queen" of anything. Gcourt91 1 year ago in reply to LohengrinTh hahahahahahaha @ a club of mentally retarded hairdressers with a rare hobby (high note production) primohomme 1 year ago in reply to Drelnis Spreading the art of opera by
worshipping coloratura for the sake of coloratura and high notes? Oh
yes, that’s great art.
I doubt you are actually studying music at all, no great musician would
think that opera can be broken down into those simple components and
that someone like Gruberova is a representation of the very best of
opera. LohengrinTh 1 year ago in reply to Gcourt91 and equally mentally retarded gays..
you see, each diva has her kind of gays and from the type of diva you
can tell the kind of her gays
Madonna for example, her gays are feminine, very mean, usually ugly and
all aged above 40 desperately wanting to believe they are still in their
teens
Grubys gays are low IQed, insidiously malicious (polite but so
complexed) with no real understanding of music, a pathological love for
coloratura and a hatred for Callas whom they consider Edita’s rival
(loooool) primohomme 1 year ago in reply to asdfopera Yes my darling, but "still singing"
doesn’t equal "singing well".
I mean, Joan Sutherland was singing better, much better, than Gruberova
at the time she retired. Gruberova is not only past her vocal prime, she
is actually in vocal decomposition process. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to coloraturafan Sweetie, hold your tits, nobody here
is actually homophobic, if anything the sentiment is phobia of stupidity
and low taste. And yes, reducing opera to high notes and coloratura IS
bad taste and it is very stupid.
Your behavior doesn’t speak well of your intelligence, claiming that you
are in the truth because your channel has more views. I guess "Gangnam
Style" is absolute truth then. You have criticized Renee Fleming and
compared her to Devia (ew) so how is this any different? primohomme 1 year ago in reply to coloraturafan But you are a fan of coloratura, not
of opera...
So you don’t get to speak about the "great art form", as you don’t seem
to appreciate opera past the vocal tricks and high notes. And you show
no understand that a solid operatic voice is more than the notes above
high C. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to Rosannasfriend Thanks :) I don’t usually block people unless their argument is completely illogical though. WestVoice 1 year ago LMAO at the coloratura stans primohomme 1 year ago in reply to coloraturafan You mad bra? LMAO, what’s more funny
as that you complain about me making fun of her gays, and what did you
do? go and send this video to a bunch of her most mentally retarded,
fanatical gays so they would come here to post ignorant comments :)
All the divas have their gays, that’s a fact, but depending on the diva
the gay is either very intelligence, cultured and stylish...or
ridiculous, stupid and lacks good taste.
Where do you think a coloratura obsession falls in that range? ;) LohengrinTh 1 year ago For some strange reason, mentally
retarded coloraturas, believe they should compare themselves to Callas
because she was also a master of coloratura.. but coloratura in Callas’
case was a mean to an end not a voice category..
It is extremely sad to see the "High Arts" (Opera..) actually as a club
of mentally retarded hairdressers with a rare hobby (high note
production) primohomme 1 year ago in reply to MegaOperafreak How very funny, you call Lohengrinth a
psychopath and yet you are the one stalking him online? Now that’s
irony.
It’s one thing to dislike a "diva" and criticize her, but it’s quite
another to become obsessed with someone online because they dislike your
"diva"...that requires a real mental pathology. Get some therapy. primohomme 1 year ago in reply to OperaMyWorld But you are gay though... |
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