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一点不同意见
送交者: modems 2004年06月16日17:03:35 于 [教育学术] 发送悄悄话

1. Exchange rate doesn't represent currency purchasing power. Even youself has mentioned 1 USD is roughly equivalent 4 RMB, not 8.3. Many research concludes that 1 USD is equivalent to 1.2 CAD in P.P., no matter how the exchange rate goes up and down. Many magazine investigations also say that major U.S. cities living cost are higher than Canadian's, never on the contrary. So the factor = 1.56 - 1.20 = 0.36

2. Universities in Canada usually pay less salaries and spent less to do the same work and accomplish the same results (major from labor and property saving). This is due to their income and living standard are 20% lower than U.S. Everybody knows that people in Texas who makes $50,000 lives as well as people in NYC/Silicon valley who makes $75,000. Not like the 50% difference in Texas and NYC, the overall estimation of U.S. and Canada difference is 20%. So the factor = 1.20 - 1.00 = 0.20

In summary: factor has to be adjusted in your calculation is 0.36 + 0.20 = 0.56


Some more comments are in the following:

http://www1.bbsland.com/education/messages/196115.html
http://www1.bbsland.com/education/messages/196126.html

Reference: http://www1.bbsland.com/education/messages/195246.html

Your question:

"你给出的这个分布很奇怪, 很难让人相信,美国有那么多的大学, 大学之间的水平不可能有巨大断层, 水平降低应当是连续的, 不会是跳跃性的. 加拿大大学为什么没有这个断层??

我想其中的原因是, 在上交的排名中, 美国很多不起眼的大学被漏掉了, 这些学校虽不太好, 但有能力进前500. 为什么会这样? 当然是为了提高中国大学的排名, 特别是使上交自己排入前500, 目前上交排在401-450.

我可能有点小人之心了, 不过我希望有人给出一个恰当的理由解释这个断层, 而不是没有任何理由的想当然."


The answer of why:

"USA can take 75% in world top 20, 58% in world top 100, and only 32% in world top 500."

1. Above comparison shows the distribution is non-linear: if anyone deduces that since "USA can take 75% in world top 20", it should also take 75% in world top 500, otherwise it's unreasonable. That's totally wrong. Actually, 32% is comparable to the U.S. GDP percentage in the world (your theory).

Almost all of the U.S. top 20 universities are private. As a group, they're very distinguished and unparalleled from any other universities in the world. Although the rest of world's universities are hard comparable to U.S. top 20, it doesn't necessarily mean U.S. universities which are out of their top 20 list are unbeatable worldwide. This also proves from one side that the quality of U.S. universities are vast, from best to worst!

2. 9 British universities are listed in world top 100, but only 2 French universities in the same list. Can you say that France is not a developed country or it's GDP+软实力 only 2/9 of Britain? In fact the top university list based on SCI/Science/Nature ... is quite favored English speaking countries, especially U.S. and U.K. (Canada is bilingual) French/Japanese/Chinese scientists may not publish all their articles in English.

3. All Canadian universities are public. They hardly compete to top U.S. private schools in terms of funding, flexibility of recruitment ... But definitely they are comparable and behave quite similar to U.S. public universities, like big ten in midwest, U. of Carlifornia system in the west or U. of Texas system in the south. Same as their U.S. countpart, public universities are not only overall better than third tier private schools, but also have less gap in quality among each other. Have anyone heard 吴征似的"巴灵顿"大学 in Canada?

4. We all agree that U.S. has top universities in the world, especially in world top 20, maybe even in world top 100. But people in 3 tier U.S. universities (out of top 100) should't dream they are also distinguished or unparalleled in the world. American are well known of their IGNORANCE and ARROGANCE, just don't understand why some of our Chinese learn these "two qualities" so fast by looking down others to make self feel better, as they just come couple years and not even a GC holder (can claim American)?

Reference: http://www1.bbsland.com/education/messages/195618.html

SJTU's list is much more objective and convincible than the way you do in GDP+软实力, which is baised and full of imagination.

You may disagree whether SJTU's methods can show all aspects of top universities, but at least their list reveals some facts based on large amount of objective data. We should try to understand/interpret well what the result list shows, but not 想当然+小人之心 to doubt their data integrity.

In general, Canada is comparable 5-6 average size U.S. states. Since the nature of all universities are public, they cannot parallel to top U.S. private schools. But also due to this nature, as a group their quality differences aren't as vast as U.S. schools. It's true: 比上不足,比下有余.

Don't blame public universties system too much. All Chinese, Hong Kong, Taiwan, Japanese, Australian and European, except U.K. universities are public. (Actually almost all over the world are public, except U.S. and U.K.) Public system makes high education more affordable and it's easy to be accessed by all classes people of the country. It do has disvantage, which is not easy to produce schools as excellent as U.S. top 20. It's a kind of leverage of whom you want to serve, elite or majority of the people. Public universities didn't prevent Eurpoean, Japan to become wealthy developed nations in the past. It benefits people like us to get education in China and doesn't stop our nation becoming a rising star in recent 20 years.

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