网友讨论: 有一位JDT
Normalman: 有一位JDT, 当其他的JDT说"神爱众人, 末日审判时大部分人都会得救的."时, 她会
面红耳赤地跳起来反驳: "有没有搞错 ((TYPO), 末日审判时得救的只是很少很少的
一部分人." 她的心里认为, 不信的和信偏的人命贱如蝼蚁, 不配与她这样的福音派
精英一同得救.
这位JDT的最大愿望就是能见到她的主的第二次到来, 因为她相信, 她的主第二次到
来之时, 世界的末日就到了. 在那末日审判的时候命贱如蚁 的不信的和信偏的都会
在她的主的怒火中灰飞烟灭, 只有信仰如她着方可以在她的主的庇护得以欣赏哪数
以十亿计的"草蚁"被BBQ 时的奇观.

-------------------------------------------------
Xinmin: Very insightful reflection. It is a biblical mystery about the details for the fearful Day of the Lord.
If this kind of fairly educated self-reflection does not deter one (such as you) from fleeing the wrath of the Almighty, what else does?
Or perhaps, we are 命贱如蚁 if we are devoid of Imago Dei. We sinners are struggling now since we are not completely devoid of God's glory, just fall short. By the time of final judgment, the unrepentant sinners will be completely devoid of God's glory and become like Satan and evil angels. They are not only 命贱如蚁, but worth absolutely nothing.

无为: 基督徒和一般人 一样的罪摆在神面前，不管我们说的再好, 理解的再好，离开了主耶稣 大家彼此彼此~~~~

-------------------------------------------------
雅亿: majority should be everyone in her mind.when Gems said "majority",she wanted to correct her at first, then she realized she better be causious, so she asked: typo?
obviously Gems understands her, for Gems responded :of course,then Gems cited the correct passage: HE died for the world (not just maojority, everyone in the world)----
unfortunately, you just proved again that: you are too shallow to understand truth.

Normalman: 南山语: Definition is the key! Since when was "majority" defined as everyone? Was it always defined as the opposite of minority?

-------------------------------------------------
罗七: 你确定过她真的认为别的人“不配与她一同得救”？ 还是你推断出来的？
如果基督徒真的被神启示知道审判的严厉，他/她的反应应该是恐惧战兢而非幸灾乐祸，因为知道自己能够逃脱完全是主的恩典。
你知道审判是有益的吗？

Normalman: 100% sure when judging from her writing . Yes, I agree that 审判是有益 and is needed. But I do not think the JDT I mentioned will be 恐惧战兢. Guess from what she wrote (referred other as ant, mantis etc) I guess she will be 幸灾乐祸

无为: 这人没有对待兄弟姐妹的真诚爱心~~~~（是你这么看人家的么？）

Normalman: "是你这么看人家的么？" 不是!

-------------------------------------------------
Normalman: Better yet. 当数以十亿计的草蚁在神的怒火中辗转呻吟时, 她会说: "我的神是至善的, 是爱你们的."
我唯一不知道的是她会不会说: 阿门, 阿门, 再忍一回儿, 少顷烤得熟透了就不痛了.

Xinmin: Those who are opposed to the Almighty will meet their fate of their own choosing.
You must not forget that those sinners in hell will also get their own resurrected bodies that enable them to sustain the eternal fire. Never imagine that they are like a chaff that will quickly burn up.
The justice will be just right for each and every sinner to mind their own business of being tormented without the possibility of harming each other.
There is no party to speak about. BBQ party, that is.

Normalman: 谢谢你的指正. 原来他/她会说
"我的神是至善的, 是爱你们的. 阿门, 阿门, 你们忍着吧, 烤得皮焦肉烂骨头酥也一样会痛的---谁让你们当初不信的."

Xinmin: More correction needed here. There will be no communication or comment about hell. Hell will be a totally forgotten place to those in heaven. God alone will bear the pain of it all, if he chooses to.

南山看客: 似乎没有圣经依据么. 身体更新有依据, 什么地方有说记忆也被更新了? 天堂门口真有孟婆茶?

Xinmin: There will be no pain of any sort. I cannot imagine any emotional pain of knowing some of my friends and relatives are being tormented in hell.
Revelation
21:1 我又看见一个新天新地．因为先前的天地已经过去了．海也不再有了。
21:2 我又看见圣城新耶路撒冷由　神那里从天而降、预备好了、就如新妇妆饰整齐、等候丈夫。
21:3 我听见有大声音从宝座出来说、看哪、　神的帐幕在人间．他要与人同住、他们要作他的子民、　神要亲自与他们同在、作他们的　神．
21:4 　神要擦去他们一切的眼泪．不再有死亡、也不再有悲哀、哭号、疼痛、因为以前的事都过去了。
21:5 坐宝座的说、看哪、我将一切都更新了。又说、你要写上．因这些话是可信的、是真实的。

南山看客: 但还是没有"抹去记忆"的直接证据.

Xinmin: It goes without saying. I believe only the happy memories will be kept, if any at all.

南山看客: 我不认可. 一个慷慨大方, 甚至给了人类自由意志的神, 不会干这种"抹去记忆"的勾当.

Xinmin: Perhaps you need to read bible more. The bible described God's forgiveness as blotting our sin and never recalling them anymore. Even God who knows everything will make himself erasing his memory of our sins.

南山看客: 严重不同意"抹去记忆"的臆想. 天堂里能有什么Advanture? 永远的Happy ending, 了无悬念, 亦无危险, 我看你怎么编, 呵呵.

Normalman: an new version of 孟婆茶----only the happy memories will be kept

罗七: 呵呵，不知钉十字架这种酷刑算不算happy memory

Normalman: Good question, looking for a thoughtful answer to it too.

南山看客: 罗七的问题大大地有陷阱. 如果回答"是", 似乎暗示上帝有受虐的倾向.
如果回答"否", 按新民的理论, 被抹去了, 最大的荣耀也抹去了.

罗七: 新民自己挖的哦，不关我的事。

Xinmin: Paradoxically not so. Here is my take. 罗七: 不知钉十字架这种酷刑算不算happy memory
南山看客:
如果回答"是", 似乎暗示上帝有受虐的倾向.
如果回答"否", 按新民的理论, 被抹去了, 最大的荣耀也抹去了.

Normalman:
Let see how Xinmin answer this.
Xinmin's answer:
Some believe that the glorious marks of the crucifixion will remain forever with Jesus in eternal home. Even if so, the memory of emotional pain of crucifixion, if any, will only be kept in the memory of God, not of us. Will we feel grateful to Christ without identifying with his emotional pain? I think so. The reason is simple: the crucifixion marks may well become the most glorious marks there ever is, other than the glory of God.

Normalman: 一个实行愚民政策的天堂. 天堂居民们 know only the crucifixion marks is the most glorious marks there ever is in the history of heaven. But they don't know why!

罗七: 看到新民为自己信口开河出来的猜想认真地辩解就乐. 就不肯说三个字：不知道。

Normalman: 所以我说他有时象全聚得的烤鸭. 肉烂了, 皮也焦了, 就剩下一张嘴还硬翘翘的.
Of course, I have to say that sometimes his knowledge can be of great help---at least to me.

Candle: He often behaves like a kid, enjoy his different layers of living beings. He shows what he is, never covers like some mask covered men. I hate to deal with those people because you never know if you are talking to the idol image or a real person with the pretended quality or a joke.

Xinmin: I take that as a great compliment. Jesus my Lord said, the Kingdom of God is for those who become like a child.

Xinmin: Hehe, I was thinking about writing a fiction about a small band of citizens in heaven trying to dig a quantum tunnel to the lake of fire after they accidentally stumbled upon a hidden corner in the libary of heaven. The hidden corner contains all the recordings about the final judgment and the names of those who went to hell.

南山看客: 或者... 有人递给你两粒药丸, 吃了红色的, 一切照旧, 吃了蓝色的, 你被抹去的记忆就会被唤醒, 然后你发现天国MATRIX和ZION背后的ZION...
这和构想很迷人, 希望你能完成写作...
图书馆的桥段象[世界尽头和冷酷仙境], 管理员"羊男"是联系过去的纽带, 呵呵, 羊的表征特性很强么...

Xinmin: Someday when I get time to write. The eternal life must be full of adventures. Boredom may be the greatest attribute of life (or more appropriately living death) in hell.

侧视: 神自己成为生命的活源，怎么会有boredom？那是这个世界的事，人脱离了活水的源头的结果。

-------------------------------------------------
Gems: some of my thoughts about Christian Salvation. I went to some bad Theology seminars for the past few days (yes, they were Catholic ones). Which provoke me did some meditations about Salvation (Sounds like I don’t do it everyday:))
The Knowledge of Christian Salvation is very simple and sufficient. Everyone beyond the age of reason can understand it fully. (Note: The age of reason is defined differently in different denominations. e.g. Catholic: 7 years old, Baptist 8 years old… you get the idea). Everyone can practice it. It did not matter if you got a PhD in Theology, if you can read or write (most saints before 16 century can not), if you can read Hebrew (I confess I hate Hebrew). There’s no hidden message, no secrete experience in Christianity. Bible is plain and simple.
But there are such a human tendency of searching the secrete knowledge or practice. They thought “Once I got the knowledge, I can go to heaven, you can not, you losers.” Or “Once I got the knowledge, I won’t mess up in my life, hello! Heaven” This is so common human tendency that every religion has a version of it. Christianity: Gnostics, Judaism: Kabbalah, Agnosticism: all new age belif...
It’s so against Basic Christian principle. For Christians, the Salvation is by Grace through Our Lord Jesus Christ. It’s a free gife from God. No one deserved it no matter how hard you studied, nor how pious you are. It’s free to everyone (Republicans’ money can not buy it (Sorry, cowboy Bush) )(Joking:))
Early Christians all understand it. That’s the reason early Catholic Bishops discarded Gnostics Gospel (e.g. Gospel of Thomas...) from the Canon.
Thanks be to God!

Normalman: Great!

无为: 纯粹的恩典！！！ 神会让人领会的，不在年龄。