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博愛思牧師解經講道:揀選(弗1:4-6)
送交者: 從上而生 2019年09月07日16:28:17 於 [彩虹之約] 發送悄悄話

Election

Ephesians 1:4–6

For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. In love he predestined us to be adopted as his sons through Jesus Christ, in accordance with his pleasure and will—to the praise of his glorious grace, which he has freely given us in the One he loves.

It is wonderful to be told, as Paul does tell us in the third verse of Ephesians 1, that God “has blessed us … with every spiritual blessing in Christ.” But as soon as that is said we immediately want to ask how such great blessing actually becomes ours. Paul describes it as “spiritual” blessing “in the heavenly realms.” But we are not in heaven; we are on earth. How can we possess the blessings God has for us?

We can imagine a number of wrong ways. The blessings of heaven might be thought to be possessed by force, which is what Satan tried to do. He tried to conquer heaven; he was conquered instead. We might try to earn these great blessings. But with what would we earn them? Heaven’s blessings must be bought by heaven’s coin. We possess no spiritual currency. Perhaps we can inherit them when the owner dies. Alas, the owner is the eternal God, who does not die. Perhaps God is gracious and is only waiting for us to ask him for these blessings. Even this will not work. For according to Scripture, we are not the kind of persons who, unaided by God, will even ask him for blessings. On the contrary, we despise God’s blessings. We want our will and our way and left to ourselves, we would never ask God for anything.

Then how is it that some people receive these blessings, as Paul says they do? The answer is in verses 4–6. It is the result of God’s own sovereign act, election. Paul says, “For [the Greek word is kathōs, meaning ‘just as’ or ‘because’; it links verses 4 and 3, as an explanation] he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. In love he predestined us to be adopted as his sons through Jesus Christ, in accordance with his pleasure and will—to the praise of his glorious grace, which he has freely given us in the One he loves.”

This teaches that the blessings of salvation come to some people because God has determined from before the creation of the world to give them to them—and for that reason only.

Election and Human Depravity

This doctrine is difficult for many persons, of course. But before we deal with their objections we would do well to consider the various views that people hold about election. There are three of them.

The first position is a denial of election outright. No one is saved because of some supreme hidden purpose of God, these objectors say. We can speak of grace, for God chose to reveal himself to fallen men and women and to provide a way of salvation through the death of his Son, the Lord Jesus Christ. That he did so proves him to be gracious. But having spoken of the grace of God in this sense, we must stop there and turn the entire situation over to human beings. God graciously offers salvation, but people must choose this salvation of their own free will. Election simply does not enter into it.

The strength of this view is that it conforms to what we all naturally like to think about our abilities. The difficulty is that, whether we like it or not, the Bible does teach this doctrine. John R. W. Stott calls election “a divine revelation, not a human speculation.” D. Martyn Lloyd-Jones refers to this teaching as “a statement, not an argument.”2 In his study of election J. C. Ryle begins by listing eleven texts (including Ephesians 1:4) that teach election in the simplest and most undeniable language and urges his readers to consider them well.

It is hard to imagine anyone doing this and then continuing to deny that election is the Bible’s teaching.

According to the second view, election is taught in Scripture but it is election based on foreknowledge. This is a mediating position, held by those who acknowledge that election is taught but who do not want to admit to a doctrine which they consider unjust and arbitrary. They would argue that God elects some to salvation and its blessings but that he does so on the basis of a choice, a response of faith, or some other good that he foresees in them.

This is patently impossible. One problem is that an election like that is not really election. In such a reconstruction God does not preordain an individual to anything; the individual actually ordains himself.

Another, greater problem is, if what the Bible tells us about the hopeless condition of man in sin is true, what good could God possibly see in anyone to cause him to elect that one to salvation? Goodness is from God. Faith is from God. If God is eliminated as a first cause of goodness or faith or a God-directed human choice (whatever it may be), how could there ever be any faith for God to foresee?

Calvin put it like this: “How should [God] foresee that which could not be? For we know that all Adam’s offspring is corrupted and that we do not have the skill to think one good thought of doing well, and much less therefore are we able to commence to do good. Although God should wait a hundred thousand years for us, if we could remain so long in the world, yet it is certain that we should never come to him nor do anything else but increase the mischief continually to our own condemnation. In short, the longer men live in the world, the deeper they lunge themselves into their own damnation. And therefore God could not foresee what was not in us before he himself put it into us.”

When people have trouble with election—and many do—their real problem is not with the doctrine of election, although they think it is, but with the doctrine of depravity that makes election necessary. 彩虹🌈一切反動派的根源👈

The question to settle is: How far did the human race fall when it fell? Did man fall upward? That is the view of secular evolutionists, that we are all getting better and better. Did man fall part way but not the whole way, so that he is damaged by sin but not ruined? That is the view of Pelagians or Arminians. It affirms that we are affected by sin but insists that we nevertheless possess the ability to turn from it and believe in Christ when the gospel is offered—by our own power. 牛大壯🐂Or did man fall the whole way so that he is no longer capable of making even the smallest movement back toward God unless God first reaches down and performs the miracle of the new birth in him? That is the view of Scripture.

The Bible says that we are “dead in … transgressions and sins” (Eph. 2:1).

It says, “There is no one … who seeks God” (Rom. 3:11).

Jesus declared, “No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him” (John 6:44).

It is written in Genesis: “The Lord saw how great man’s wickedness on the earth had become, and that every inclination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil all the time” (Gen. 6:5).

What good could God possibly foresee in hearts that are dead in transgressions and sins and inclined only to evil all the time? What good could God anticipate in people who cannot come to him and do not even seek him unless he first draws them to himself? If that is the situation, as the Bible says it is, then the only way any man or woman can be saved is by the sovereign election of God by which he first chooses some for salvation and then leads them to faith.

The third position is election pure and simple. It teaches that we are too hopelessly lost in sin ever to partake of God’s great spiritual blessings on our own. Instead, God in his mercy chose us and then made his choice effectual. First he made our salvation possible by sending the Lord Jesus Christ to die for our sin. Then he made us capable of responding to him by sending the Holy Spirit to open our eyes to the truth and glory of the gospel. Thus, all the blessings we enjoy must be traced back to this sovereign electing purpose of God toward us in Jesus Christ. And Paul does exactly that in these opening verses of Ephesians.

Arminian Objections

Objections to the Bible’s teaching about election have been around for a long time, and there are many of them. Here I consider two: that election is arbitrary and that it is unjust.

When election is described as arbitrary we need to understand precisely what we are talking about. If we are basing the accusation on any supposed quality in man that is imagined to call forth election, then there is a sense in which election is arbitrary. From our perspective there is no reason why one individual rather than another should be elected. But generally that is not the way the charge is made. Generally the objector means that election is arbitrary, not from our perspective, but from God’s perspective. It amounts to saying that God has no reason for what he does. He is utterly arbitrary in picking one individual rather than another. It could as easily have been the other way around. Or God could have picked no one.

That last sentence indicates the way through this problem. For as soon as we think of the possibility of no one being saved we run against the very purpose Paul talks about in Ephesians 1:6, namely, that salvation is “to the praise of his [God’s] glorious grace.” That is, God purposed to glorify himself by saving some. Since that is so, election is not arbitrary. It has a purpose from God’s point of view.

But why one person rather than another? Why more than one? Or why not everyone? These are good questions, but it does not take a great deal of understanding to recognize that they are of another order entirely. Once we admit that God has a purpose in election, it is evident that the purpose must extend to the details of God’s choice. We do not know why he elects one rather than another, but that is quite a different thing from saying that he has no reasons. In fact, in so great an enterprise, an enterprise which forms the entire meaning of human history, it would be arrogant for us to suppose that we could ever understand the whole purpose. We can speculate. We can see portions of God’s purpose in specific instances of election. But on the whole we will have to do as Paul does and confess that predestination is simply “in accordance with [God’s] pleasure and will” (v. 5).

The second objection is that election is unjust. It is unjust for God to choose one rather than another, we are told. All must be given an equal chance. But is it possible that a person can still so misunderstand what is involved as to think in these categories? An equal chance! We have had a chance, but we have wasted it by rejecting the gospel. And it makes no difference how many “chances” are given, or to how many. Apart from God’s sovereign work no one follows Jesus. So far as justice is concerned, what would justice decree for us, if justice (and nothing but justice) should be done? Justice would decree our damnation! Justice would sentence us to hell!

It is not justice we want from God; it is grace. And grace cannot be commanded. It must flow to us from God’s sovereign purposes decreed before the foundation of the world, or it must not come at all.

Blessings of Election

Election is not the problem some have made it to be. In fact, it is actually a great blessing of the gospel. It is so in at least four areas.

1. Election eliminates boasting. Critics of election talk as if the opposite were true. They think it is the height of arrogance, something hardly to be tolerated, for a person to claim that he or she has been chosen to salvation. They suppose it is a claim to be worth more or to have done something better than other people. But, of course, election does not imply that at all. Election means that salvation is utterly of God. As Paul says, “he chose,” “he predestined,” “he has freely given,” and this is “to the praise of his glorious grace” and not to our glory.

Only election eliminates all grounds for boasting. Suppose it were otherwise. Suppose that in the final analysis a person could get to heaven on the basis of something he or she had done. In that case, that individual could claim some part (small or large) of the glory. In fact, it would be the critical part, the part that distinguished him or her from those who were not saved. That is why salvation’s blessings have to be ours by election alone.

2. Election gives assurance of salvation. Suppose it were otherwise. Suppose the ultimate grounds of salvation were in ourselves. In that case, salvation would be as unstable as we are. We might be saved one moment and lost the next. As Calvin says, “If … our faith were not grounded in God’s eternal election, it is certain that Satan might pluck it from us every minute.”

Calvin found security of salvation in the “adoption,” which verse 5 says God’s election provides for us. Adoption means that we are taken into God’s family so that we become his children and he becomes our heavenly Father. Calvin points out that when we pray to God we must call him Father, for that is what Jesus taught us to do (see Matt. 6:9). But how can we do that, he asks, unless we are sure that he really is our Father? If not, then our prayers are mere hypocrisy and the first words we utter in them (“Our Father …”) are a lie. “We must be thoroughly resolved and persuaded in ourselves that God counts us as his children. And how may that be but by embracing his mercy through faith, as he offers it to us in his gospel, and by assuring ourselves also that we are grounded in his eternal election?”

3. Election leads to holiness. A person might say, “Well, if I am elect, I suppose I’ll be saved regardless of what I do; therefore, I’ll enjoy myself and sin all I please.” Those who say that either are not elect or else are elect but are not yet regenerate. Why? Because, as verse 3 says, election is to holiness. That is, election to salvation and election to holiness go together. They are never separated. So, as John Stott says, “Far from encouraging sin, the doctrine of election forbids it and lays upon us instead the necessity of holiness.” If we are not growing in holiness, we are not elect. We are still in our sins.

4. Finally, election promotes evangelism. Some think that election makes evangelism unnecessary. “For if God is going to save certain individuals anyway,” the argument goes, “then he will save them, and there is no point in my having anything to do with it.” It does not work that way. The fact that God elects to salvation does not eliminate the means by which he calls those elect persons to faith. One of those means is the proclamation of the gospel to sinners by those who already believe (1 Cor. 1:21). The very Paul who wrote this letter was the first great missionary.

Moreover, it is only as we recognize the importance of election that we gain hope in evangelism. Think about it. If the hearts of men and women are as opposed to God and his ways as the Bible says they are, and if God does not elect people and then call them effectively by means of the Holy Spirit so that they respond in saving faith, what hope could you or I possibly have of winning them? If God cannot call effectively, it is certain that you and I cannot. On the other hand, if God is doing this work on the basis of his prior election of some, then we can speak the word of truth boldly, knowing that all whom God has previously determined to come to faith will come to him.

We do not know who God’s elect are. The only way we can find them out is by their response to the gospel and by their subsequent growth in holiness. Our task is to proclaim the Word boldly, knowing that all whom God has elected in Christ before the foundation of the world will surely come to Jesus.[1]

 



[1] Boice, J. M. (1988). Ephesians: an expositional commentary (pp. 14–19). Grand Rapids, MI: Ministry Resources Library.


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    阿古花異端:信是自己信的,自己自發信的。  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (91)
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      因基督創始的信而被基督稱義——花徒信仰;直接將揩油徒劈死☝️  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (117)
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        褻瀆子哀嚎也沒用!直接死去。:)  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (79)
    阿古堅決反對因信稱義,你的信救了你!:))  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (111)
        你瞧瞧你的加大異端神學有多爛!要多爛有多爛!:) - repentant 09/09/19 (121)
        還有,不是聖靈重生信心?而是耶穌創始的?你就糊塗死吧。:)  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (111)
          答案:耶穌撒種在前,聖靈動工在後。聖靈用福音真道重生人。 - repentant 09/09/19 (142)
        哈哈,是耶穌創始信心?不是父?自己劈死自己吧。:) - repentant 09/09/19 (133)
          創世前就被父指定信耶穌的人,不是罪人,是神人! - repentant 09/09/19 (114)
          父創始前預定了具體得救者信徒,必然預定了信心。大異端! - repentant 09/09/19 (115)
        哪個腦補昏蛋說的?😅 來! 認個錯!👈  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (85)
      我高興的劈死你!:)加大異端,阿古病毒。  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (94)
  Sound doctrine:揀選 - YeSuShiZhu 09/09/19 (163)
    你只會貼標籤,喊口號!!  /無內容 - gaolian 09/09/19 (107)
      老苗喊的口號句句精煉,你得pay attention☝️  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (119)
      老苗喊的口號句句精煉,你得pay attention☝️  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (440)
    Against the Sound doctrine:揀選 - YeSuShiZhu 09/09/19 (108)
      你懂得“在基督里揀選了我們”的意思嗎?就是基督也參與了揀選☝  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (142)
        在基督裡面,就是服從基督,靠着基督。其他對照看去。 - repentant 09/09/19 (133)
          任何的經文經過你那雙鬥雞眼一看就成了異端👈  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (125)
        耶穌只救父預定揀選的人=耶穌在父裡面揀選了我們。異端!👈  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (122)
          那是那節經文直白的意思,你就是那種欠揍的破爛👈  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (137)
            棄子而定的貨! 👈  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (119)
              有意思,反對基督參與揀選的是你,不是我啊,傻蛋👈  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (107)
                強調: 創世前的預定揀選計劃,只有父制定,基督不制定!☝️ - repentant 09/09/19 (101)
                  那麼,“在基督里”揀選這個詞組對你來說是什麼意思呢?  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (103)
                    你該滾了!謝謝。  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (124)
                      你為什麼發怒呢?你為什麼變了臉色呢? 7你若行得好,豈不蒙悅 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (128)
                        因為阿古死蠢!罰你讀貼20遍。你所有問題就都解決了!  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (105)
                蠢貨! 時空中只有耶穌揀選人。但創世前預定揀選卻不是父子同工 - repentant 09/09/19 (125)
                  “在基督里”揀選這個詞組對你來說是什麼意思呢?  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (105)
                    在基督裡面,就是服從基督,靠着基督。其他對照看去。 - repentant 09/09/19 (108)
                      寶貝,任何經文的字句都是有它嚴密的語法的,那個詞組是 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (119)
                        父全權委派讓基督做主救贖,和審判!你滾吧  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (103)
                          你為什麼發怒呢?你為什麼變了臉色呢? 7你若行得好,豈不蒙悅 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (90)
                            我高興的請阿古蠢貨滾!謝謝:))  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (90)
                蠢貨! 時空中只有耶穌揀選人。但創世前預定揀選卻不是父子同工 - repentant 09/09/19 (164)
        不揍還你不行! 👈父在基督里的揀選,一定是基督去揀選☝️  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (110)
          揀選那個act發生在eternity past☝️ - 從上而生 09/09/19 (135)
            創世前基督已經被揀選,對! 在時空中降世救人卻只是計劃! - repentant 09/09/19 (124)
            這蠢貨只信人本,不信聖經! 拿破文章當證據? 蠢!  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (133)
              寶貝,那正是經文的本意,你的鬥雞眼一瞪就全亂套了 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (121)
                你繼續蠢吧。我救不了你!😎  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (87)
            計劃揀選= 已經揀選了。你就是個大腦殘嘛!  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (105)
              註:這裡指時空中的揀選人還沒實現,但基督是創世前定了的。 - repentant 09/09/19 (121)
        不揍還你不行! 👈父在基督里的揀選,一定是基督去揀選☝️  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (93)
        那你也欠揍! 聖經說的是父的預定,不是父子同工的預定!☝️  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (106)
          懊悔哥傻腦袋被老古扇得左右暈眩不知道要歪向何方了😁 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (115)
            阿古快去找經文支持,別慫! 😂  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (119)
              弗1:4☝️  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (114)
                父創世前預定揀選了: 耶穌降世救人(揀選人) - repentant 09/09/19 (137)
                  父揀選基督降世救贖和父在基督里揀選我們被救贖一丁點都不衝突啊 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (120)
                    估計懊悔兄看到的區別在於:名單到底是誰定的? - gaolian 09/09/19 (128)
                      第2點,基本正確! 第1點是花異端的幻想。但是 - repentant 09/09/19 (144)
                        皋臉你看,我木有冤枉懊悔哥吧?他就是一個阿米念痢疾👈  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (119)
                          你就是加爾文一個神經病,大異端!:)兩位都找死!  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (105)
                        以弗所書 2:8, 中的“這/this”到底指代什麼?? - gaolian 09/09/19 (126)
                          顯然第2點,所有人都同意的。但是第1點呢? - repentant 09/09/19 (123)
                            信是回應聖靈的呼召,這沒錯。問題是。。。 - gaolian 09/09/19 (141)
                              當然不是了!福音一到,有人信有人不信。很正常。 - repentant 09/09/19 (125)
                                看電影。很形象。謝謝!!如果我被“電影”(福音)感動。。。 - gaolian 09/09/19 (110)
                                  正確。沒有什麼強迫一說。  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (117)
                                    我也覺得,如果是神“強迫”我信的,那我信主也無法榮耀神了。  /無內容 - gaolian 09/09/19 (110)
                                      因信得救,是神的恩典,白白的賜予! - repentant 09/09/19 (98)
                                        但也有是神直接召的,似乎是強迫。 - gaolian 09/09/19 (102)
                                          但是呼召本身還不夠,必須福音和聖靈去重生! - repentant 09/09/19 (79)
                                          那是耶穌的呼召,也是神工; 也有像小孩子一樣謙卑的人。  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (99)
                                            對,是耶穌呼召。保羅也是耶穌直接呼召!也是不可抗拒的!  /無內容 - gaolian 09/09/19 (98)
                                              思考題:掃羅像小孩子一樣謙卑嗎?  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (99)
                                                我都說了,你也是眼瞎。保羅是被耶穌神跡顯現震服! - repentant 09/09/19 (88)
                                  那是因為你“明白”電影的內容,但保羅說了沒一個“明白”的☝️ - 從上而生 09/09/19 (110)
                                    耶穌救贖,全權代表父,父不在時空中親為! 死異端眼瞎嗎? - repentant 09/09/19 (110)
                                    阿古花異端散播毒素,滾一邊去吧!👈  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (115)
                                    又是棄子而工的大異端!😅 這廝要用明白砸死自己! - repentant 09/09/19 (129)
                                      撒種後,人不信福音,也不是因為不明白福音。而是不信! - repentant 09/09/19 (112)
                                    又是棄子而工的大異端!😅 這廝要用明白砸死自己! - repentant 09/09/19 (841)
                                看電影。很形象。謝謝!!如果我被“電影”(福音)感動。。。 - gaolian 09/09/19 (161)
                                牛大壯🐂自己可以回應?  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (107)
                                  這蠢貨,腦補王一個! - repentant 09/09/19 (93)
                                  哪個腦補昏蛋說的?😅 來! 認個錯!👈  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (101)
                          指啥對阿米念都是個災難:信或救恩都不是出於自己☝️  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (123)
                            除了這裡,說“信出於恩典”的經文在哪?  /無內容 - gaolian 09/09/19 (109)
                              要明白這個問題,你得懂得“重生”這個教義,以及重生先於信心的 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (112)
                              所以我對你們說過,若不是蒙我父的恩賜,沒有人能到我這裡來。 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (92)
                      太逗了😁你一點都沒錯,#2是懊悔哥的意思,也是阿米念的經典 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (98)
                        我的說法完全按照聖經說的,聖經說了信就了你,也說了 - repentant 09/09/19 (122)
                        看到沒有? 花異端看到信就犯病! 因信稱義也是阿米念了😂  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (102)
                        這個昏蛋,又是腦補外添聖經! 信是什麼? 是順服基督。😂  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (109)
                          你為什麼發怒呢?你為什麼變了臉色呢? 7你若行得好,豈不蒙悅 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (112)
                            就該劈死你這異端,不服?:)  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (98)
                    標題正確。計劃和現實,你一塌糊塗! - repentant 09/09/19 (116)
                時空中只有耶穌在揀選人! 這就是父創世前所預定的!☝️ - repentant 09/09/19 (138)
                  父在基督里的揀選的act在創世以前已經“完成了”,醒醒,寶貝  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (154)
                    哈! 父預定揀選時空的人信耶穌,當然是創世前完成的計劃!☝️ - repentant 09/09/19 (136)
                      問題是誰說了“創世前就信了,就得救了”?不是那個打稻草人的大 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (164)
                        如果父創世前就定好了名單,那麼在名單上的人是必得救無疑的了。 - gaolian 09/09/19 (164)
                          對!父只是預定世人在基督里得救,要過基督這一關。 - repentant 09/09/19 (121)
                          寶貝,我們都不是機器人,我們都比機器人更壞! - 從上而生 09/09/19 (163)
                            你是說,耶和華說錯了?(瑪拉基3:7)Y/N?  /無內容 - gaolian 09/09/19 (190)
                              耶和華沒有說錯,是你理解錯了👈 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (201)
                                還硬拽?一邊滾去!這是父的呼召,本身就是神工!  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (171)
                                  寶貝,父藉着祂的靈所做的呼召就是你一貫反對的有效呼召,又叫做 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (198)
                                    蠢!那是舊約的事!舊約父在時空還見摩西呢。  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (178)
                                      約6:44是舊約?  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (197)
                                        你怎麼死的都不明白?:) - repentant 09/09/19 (204)
                                        沒給你解釋過?那是指舊約先知律法的教導,指向耶穌! - repentant 09/09/19 (171)
                        人得救,必須看時空; 父和耶穌也不例外。沒有擬好的得救名單! - repentant 09/09/19 (129)
                        人得救,必須看時空; 父和耶穌也不例外。沒有擬好的得救名單!  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (424)
                        哈哈! 那麼怎麼會有得救名單? 去救贖,等於已經救了?😂  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (128)
                哪裡說基督參加預定了? 基督預定自己降世????👈 - repentant 09/09/19 (88)
            哈哈! 這作者被我劈死! 類推創世? 找經文去!😅  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (96)
              我看是有人醉死了☝️  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/09/19 (104)
                腦補類推創世? 大腦補一個!  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (95)
        謝謝阿古否定了: 耶穌只救父預定的人。😂  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (88)
      我需要反腦殘外添嗎! 我的立論成立,其他垃圾自然完蛋!😎  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (106)
      垃圾需要看嗎? 啊?! 你一張嘴,就知道你人本的垃圾!👈  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (94)
    你哪裡是父在基督里預定得救的了?👈 - repentant 09/09/19 (117)
      耶穌只救父預定的人,完全違背聖經: 父在基督里的預定!  /無內容 - repentant 09/09/19 (125)
    分析: 父預定通過耶穌救人 - repentant 09/09/19 (115)
      類似三位一體,神性平等,分工不同 - repentant 09/09/19 (102)
      父不但預知有信耶穌的,也有不信耶穌的。對應 - repentant 09/09/19 (104)
      額外的問題: 罪人的智力和秉性屬於魂嗎? - repentant 09/08/19 (125)
    其最終目的就是:耶穌想救誰也得看牛大壯的臉色🐂  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (108)
      阿古,來認個錯!👈  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (121)
      耶穌自己的話(約6:44,65)讓懊悔哥蛋痛😄👈  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (126)
        謝謝你支持我的觀點! 😊  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (99)
    可見父的預定不是多麼難以理解的事! - repentant 09/08/19 (138)
      有人就是喜歡做痢疾夢👈  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (110)
      你讀主貼了嗎?把你看得透透滴☝  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (122)
      預定就是說聖子聖靈一定將父預定的人妥妥滴救出來👍  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (112)
        預定就是說聖子聖靈一定將父預定的時空中的人妥妥滴救出來👍  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (120)
          一定是父在基督里預定的人,基督是揀選者。  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (92)
        謝謝你支持我的觀點! 😊  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (106)
      聖靈唯獨在父揀選的人心裡動工:彼得就是,猶大不是  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (119)
        哪個腦補昏蛋說的?😅  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (110)
      預定就是救贖計劃,耶穌實施,子不會救父沒預定的人  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (122)
        哪個腦補昏蛋說的?😅  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (102)
  阿古預定編程說,又把自己砸死了事! - repentant 09/08/19 (139)
        後面的步驟就自動化了嗎? 啊?! 不做工,你做夢啊?👈  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (137)
          因着子和靈對父的順服,一切都無可抗拒滴成就了👍  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (128)
            啊?! 神不做工? 你做夢啊?👈  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (130)
              啥意思?你bipolar?  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (110)
        你眼瞎啊! 預定的實現在時空中要做工! 編你個頭啊? - repentant 09/08/19 (126)
          “預定”的作為早已完成,不存在在時空中實現的問題☝ - 從上而生 09/08/19 (131)
            想法=現實? 阿古的腦補大夢嘛!😂  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (123)
              那叫做父神善良純全的旨意👍而後成就的步驟不再叫預定揀選了  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (132)
                我管你叫什麼! 想法=現實? 阿古的腦補大夢嘛!😂  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (133)
                  旨意得以成全👍如何成全?父用祂的子和靈成就祂的旨意👍  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (121)
                    哈哈! 那就是說: 預定旨意還是要在時空中實現完成嘛!😂  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (118)
                      預定的“作為”早已完成👍我知道你痴呆不懂這個👈  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (110)
                        想法=現實? 阿古的腦補大夢嘛!😂  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (115)
                        哪個昏蛋說想法沒完成了?:)) - repentant 09/08/19 (130)
                    既然阿古反駁不了,就來認個錯吧!😎  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (108)
            讓聖經狠狠打這廝愚蠢的臉! 預定完成什麼了?👈 - repentant 09/08/19 (142)
              木有人反對這個,因為你少年痴呆,所以你無法明白這個 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (122)
                怎麼就不存在預定計劃時空中實現的問題了? 啊! - repentant 09/08/19 (106)
                  寶貝,我看你始終不明白啥叫預定,預定的“作為”早已完成,你懂 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (105)
            誰不分開了? 啊?! 阿古紙上談兵就行了嗎?😂  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (118)
          你個蠢豬頭,  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (127)
            還做夢?! 👈腦補的美夢很享受嘛😄  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (126)
    怒怒怒怒,古式編程乃是醬紫滴: - 從上而生 09/08/19 (151)
        您讓爛牙醫屈居第二👍  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (121)
  阿古呢? 哪裡去了? 認錯難產嗎?😎  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (129)
      你認錯就好! 😊 阿古不愧是不認聖經的花異端代表!👈  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (132)
        我又錯了,我收回昨天的認錯:還是懊悔哥最蠢,爛牙醫屈居第二☝  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (143)
          以後阿古認錯要經常化,制度化! 明白?👈  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (126)
            懊悔哥愚蠢第一☝️  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (116)
    這廝想肢解三位一體?👈  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (171)
        為啥叫“一體”?👈  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (140)
          不用你操心! 認聖經怎麼說的吧!👈👈 一灘漿糊腦袋!  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (140)
      哪個昏蛋說的?😅 大腦補子一個嘛  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (125)
      哪個昏蛋說的?😅 大腦補子一個嘛  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (147)
      “救恩的次序” 乃是醬紫滴☝️ - 從上而生 09/08/19 (129)
    父在救人方面在時空中動工做了什麼? - repentant 09/08/19 (188)
      阿古瞎眼不看貼就來胡說嗎? 罰你讀貼10遍!😎  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (150)
        啥叫“給非信徒的”?亞當的後裔有天生是信徒的?  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (143)
          有阿古這麼蠢的嗎? 眼瞎就再看3遍! 😂  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (136)
      除了上面的工,父又有做具體人的工嗎? 啊?! - repentant 09/08/19 (163)
      打稻草人的胳膊累了木有?😁  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/08/19 (159)
        打斷你硬拽的胳膊!😂  /無內容 - repentant 09/08/19 (158)
  懊悔哥大昏蛋和小舅舅堪憂☝️  /無內容 - 從上而生 09/07/19 (132)
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